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Pocket GPS World :: View topic - Road Angel/Toshiba e740
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Road Angel/Toshiba e740

 
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cavlabking
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Joined: May 31, 2004
Posts: 1

PostPosted: Tue Jun 01, 2004 12:11 pm    Post subject: Road Angel/Toshiba e740 Reply with quote

Can someone help please?I want to use the GPS output from my Road Angel to my Toshiba e740(bluetooth) running TomTom 2--it runs ok with a Haicom cf at the moment.However,Holux have told me that the RA outputs it's NMEA data using RS232 protocol,whereas The toshiba can only receive TTL levels I've been unable to confirm any of this,Blackspot technical haven't replied to me==are they compatible??
CAVLABKING
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Pc-Mobile
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Joined: 26/10/2002 10:38:36
Posts: 789
Location: Hong Kong

PostPosted: Fri Jun 04, 2004 5:02 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

You need a serial interface for the Toshiba.

As e740 does no thave serial port, you need a USB host cable (or the Toshiba Expansion pack) plus USB>serial converter to achieve this.

See: http://pc-mobile.net/toshiba.htm
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RajUk
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Joined: 05/09/2003 15:00:31
Posts: 19
Location: United Kingdom

PostPosted: Fri Jun 04, 2004 5:17 pm    Post subject: Re Toshiba and Roadangel Reply with quote

Hiya I too have a e740 and road angel

Youre exactly right. Re what HOLUX have said and i have one of their cables which refuses to work !!!!

Most GPS receivers output serial data in two forms

RS232-DGPS mode and TTL RS232.

It depends on the Reciver to PDA cable on how this data is used.

ANy GPS manufacter you chose, their GPS TO PDA cables all have a PROFILIC bridge chip which allows teh PDA to use serial data outputed from a GPS reciever.

The compaq and medion PDA cables can accept Rs232/dgps and TTL/rs232.

The Road angel outputs data as RS232-dgps only.


Therefore the compaq and medion cable is ok with this.


All of the custom made GPS to PDA cables designed for a Toshiba e740 seem to only be able to accept RS232-TTl data

This is the damn problem. Apparently it is too expnsive for the GPS makers to make a cable for the Toshiba which accepts Rs232-DGPS--which is what we want in addition to Rs232-TTL.



PC- mobile of hong kong do a solution. They have profilc USB to serial bridge, which allows a serial port on the E740.

This adapter is tiny about 5cm long in total.

This port/adapter DOES allow RS232-DGPS and RS232-TTL, so this actuall works with the Road Angel and PDA.

But the problem is you need to have a
1 Toshiba exansion pack- which has the usb connection, where the usb to serial port connects.
2 A seperate power supply for teh toshiba
3 An extension for the serial cable- to connect the adapter to the Road angel.



This all become really messy in the car, with cables everywhere.

Ideally one would want one of those special cable that are all in.


My Road angel works if i need it to, but i went and bought a GPS Smart bluetooth reciver. Hardwire it in the boot and left it there.


Hope this is off some help. email me if you need advice.
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DavidW
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Joined: 17/05/2003 02:26:21
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PostPosted: Sun Jun 06, 2004 2:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'm a little confused as to why DGPS comes into this.


There's two voltage levels used on serial ports. Truel RS232 is +12V and -12V. However, TTL voltage levels are sometimes used on serial ports (most UARTs and other serial chips run at TTL levels, and need a voltage level convertor chip like the famous MAX232 to convert to true RS232 levels) - which means 5V and 0V are used.

The two are incompatible.


It sounds like what you're saying is that the Road Angel works at real RS232 voltages, but that most Toshiba cables lack the voltage convertor chip and can only work at TTL voltage levels. I can't confirm any of this - I'm just trying to clarify what has been said.



David
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RajUk
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Joined: 05/09/2003 15:00:31
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PostPosted: Mon Jun 07, 2004 4:16 am    Post subject: re ttl rs232 Reply with quote

Hiya


what you mention sound familar

The chap at holux explained it to me last year when i had the problem.

Basically the types of signal TTL and Rs232. The talk of voltage did come up, and he wastaking about wiring a convertor inline?


The same problem as with Toshiba PDA cables is also with the DEll Axim axim cables.


I have come across an American website who do a serial cable for E740.

It has a switch for converting the signal to TTL or Rs232 and is powered.
http://www.thesupplynet.com/toshiba-e740-cables.cfm

It is 50 dollars plus 20 dollars shiping and customs whoch woule be about 40 pounds.

I use a fortuna bluetooth now but this may be of use to the chap who streted the post
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Pc-Mobile
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 09, 2004 5:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Most PDAs have serial ports.
And there are 2 kinds of serial ports that PDAs have: RS232 or TTL.

RS232 cost a little more because of additional chip used.

To communicate to other serial device, both must have the same level - RS232>RS232 or TTL>TTL

Current and recent PDAs with RS232 serial ports are: (ones that we cover)
Ipaq 36/37/38/39/22/41/54/55xx
O2 XDA I & II
Fujitsu Loox 600
Viewsonic V35/36/37, Mio 338 and clones
HP Jornada 53/54/56x
Palm M5xx, 125/130/i705, Tungsten C/T/W, Zire71
Sony Clie S/N series

Current and recent PDAs with TTL serial ports are: (ones that we cover)
Dell Axim X5, X3
Casio E125/EM500 etc
Asus A620
Sony Clie T/Tx/Nx/Sx series

Current and recent PDAs WITHOUT any serial ports are (so you cannot connect any GPS):
HP Ipaq 19xx
Tungsten E, Zire, Zire72
Sony Clie UX50
Toshiba e310/33x/74x/75x

Current and recent PDAs WITHOUT any serial ports but equipped with USB Host port: (so you can use the USB port to change to serial)
Toshiba e33x/74x/75x
Toshiba e40x
Toshiba e80x (this also has a serial port)

I repeat, to communicate to other serial device, both must have the same level - RS232>RS232 or TTL>TTL. So depending on the PDA and the serial device to be connected, the serial port of the PDA may have to be changed from RS232>TTL, or from TTL>RS232, usually via additional circuitry built into the cable connecting the 2 devices.
If both devices are of the same, no additional circuitry is necessary. In other words, it is connected directly wire>wire.

All handheld GPS are RS232. MANY Mouse type GPS (e.g. Holux) have dual output - RS232 AND TTL !

Example:
To connect Ipaq 221x to a Garmin handheld, direct ire connection can be used as both are RS232.
To connect Axim X3 to a Garmin handheld, additional electronic circuitry must be built into cable to change TTL of the Axim to RS232 level. So these cables are more expensive.
For most mouse GPS, it is almost always direct wire using either TTL or RS232 output depending on the PDA to be connected. (I may be wrong but this is what I assume as we do not make such cables)

As for the Toshiba e740, A USB host cable (or Expansion pack) is needed and then a USB>serial converter, and then connect to the GPS serial cable.

A USB>serial converter contains usually a chip to convert USB to TTL serial, and an additional chip to further convert to RS232.

For connecting to a mouse GPS, RS232 is not necessary so manufacturer can omit the RS232 chip in the cable and use just TTL, which is the case with the Toshiba>mouse GPS cables.

The same also applies to mobile phones. Most mobiles phones with modem built in are TTL (e/g/ most Siemens)

I hope you can make sense of all these and take it as reference.
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