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Static Cameras
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tonik
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Joined: Mar 02, 2006
Posts: 53
Location: Derbyshire

PostPosted: Sat Aug 31, 2019 8:54 am    Post subject: Static Cameras Reply with quote

I was recently 'caught' speeding by a 'manned' speed camera on Wetherby Road, Boroughbridge. I cannot specifically say that I was travelling within the speed limit but I have a couple of question that maybe someone can help with: (1) North Yorksire Police refuse to send me photographic evidence (2) the alleged speed is far greater than I would normally expect.
Ok a couple of m.p.h. over I accept but they are stating 19m.p.h. over the limit. I subscribe to the database but never saw this camera.
Does 'manned' mean Gatso or Mobile ?
Do North Yorkshire Police have to provide photographic evidence ?
Can I ask for proof of calibration of the device ?

Thanks
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M8TJT
The Other Tired Old Man
The Other Tired Old Man


Joined: Apr 04, 2006
Posts: 9656
Location: Bexhill, East Sussex, UK

PostPosted: Sat Aug 31, 2019 9:17 am    Post subject: Re: Static Cameras Reply with quote

tonik wrote:
North Yorksire Police refuse to send me photographic evidence
They are probably mot obliged to
Quote:
Does 'manned' mean Gatso or Mobile ?
If it is not fixed permanently to the ground, it's a mobile.
Quote:
Do North Yorkshire Police have to provide photographic evidence ?
Two sources of evidence: The camera and Mr Plod holding the cam (or was it a safety partnership van?)
Quote:
Can I ask for proof of calibration of the device ?
Of course you can ask. Whether they are obliged to comply with your request would be another story
Quote:
I subscribe to the database but never saw this camera.
Do you 'include mobile' cameras?
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sussamb
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Joined: Mar 18, 2011
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Location: West Sussex

PostPosted: Sat Aug 31, 2019 10:20 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Out of interest what is the speed limit on that road? If you're confident that you weren't going 19mph over, which would probably be about 25 on your speedo, select the option to go to court when they will have to provide the evidence.
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M8TJT
The Other Tired Old Man
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Joined: Apr 04, 2006
Posts: 9656
Location: Bexhill, East Sussex, UK

PostPosted: Sat Aug 31, 2019 10:58 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

And loose and pay a much bigger fine? They have you by the my friend.
How do you prove you were not speeding?
The 'amount over' does not affect the fact that you were (probably) over, but might affect the fine if you go to court.
Remember that 19MPH over a 30, is pretty much 50 with a speedo reading of probably about 55 so if you were doing that, you would deffo know it.
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marksfish
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Joined: Jun 25, 2005
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Location: Sandy, Bedfordshire

PostPosted: Sat Aug 31, 2019 11:58 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

When I received my NIP from Cambs & Suffolk constabulary 5 years ago, it stated photographic evidence would only be provided in the event of a court appearance Sad

When I got my NIP from the Hadecs3 cameras from Essex constabulary, there was a link to the 5 images, plus the calibration certificate. This NIP (luckily) was cancelled due to a technical error!

Would be so much easier if everyone played by the same rules Rolling Eyes
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b33jay
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Joined: Apr 05, 2012
Posts: 196

PostPosted: Sat Aug 31, 2019 5:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Most forces will supply, if requested, a photograph "to assist in identifying the driver" - don't mention evidence or such. Of course, a rearview shot wouldn't help in this respect!

Querying the calibration or technical information about the camera will achieve nothing other than a large additional cost for the qualified expert who will prove it was working correctly.
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tonik
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Joined: Mar 02, 2006
Posts: 53
Location: Derbyshire

PostPosted: Sun Sep 01, 2019 7:22 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks for all your help guys. It definitely wasn't a mobile or Safety Partnership van. I didn't even see it hence the fact that I didn't add it to the PGPSW site and I always keep an eye out for them. Sent them a letter asking for a photo again and queried the speed but not going to risk taking it to Court
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M8TJT
The Other Tired Old Man
The Other Tired Old Man


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Location: Bexhill, East Sussex, UK

PostPosted: Sun Sep 01, 2019 8:02 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

A 'mobile' is not limited to 'SP' vans, but includes sites where plods with handheld cams operate which it sounds like how you were caught.
Having said that, I think that Kojak with a Kodak usually stops you there and then. He did when I got caught anyway.
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dales
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Joined: May 04, 2008
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Location: Knaresborough, North Yorkshire.

PostPosted: Sun Sep 01, 2019 11:37 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

If you were driving on the A1M there, they use a camera van high up on the bridge across the road, where it is not easy to spot.
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tonik
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Joined: Mar 02, 2006
Posts: 53
Location: Derbyshire

PostPosted: Sun Sep 01, 2019 11:55 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The NIP says Wetherby Road (South), Boroughbridge in a 30mph area for the record. Next time I'm in the area I'll find the bl..dy thing and add it to the Cameras. It must have been a hidden Gatso I think but I'm pretty certain that I wouldn't be doing 49mph even in a 40 limit. Looks like penalty points for me
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b33jay
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Joined: Apr 05, 2012
Posts: 196

PostPosted: Sun Sep 01, 2019 11:57 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

tonik wrote:
Thanks for all your help guys. It definitely wasn't a mobile or Safety Partnership van. I didn't even see it hence the fact that I didn't add it to the PGPSW site and I always keep an eye out for them. Sent them a letter asking for a photo again and queried the speed but not going to risk taking it to Court


Querying the speed is counterproductive as the accuracy of the devices used is impossible to challenge.

You now risk the possibility of not being offered a Speed Awareness Course in place of a fixed penalty and going straight to a Single Justice Procedure Notice.

Have you returned the S 175 form as the process continues whilst you are prevaricating?

Edit: Just noticed it's 49 in a 30 so it may well be more than a fine.

https://www.rac.co.uk/drive/advice/legal/speeding-fines/
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sussamb
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Location: West Sussex

PostPosted: Sun Sep 01, 2019 12:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

If you're serious about your driving style then you'd certainly know about 49 in a 30. Don't suppose you have any dashcam footage to help with an appeal?
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Kremmen
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Location: West London

PostPosted: Sun Sep 01, 2019 1:11 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Agree.

I may drift over the limit from time to time but never anywhere near 49 in a 30.

Is there a 50 to 30 speed change where a camera may have trapped you as you were just throttling back.

If it was a hand held mobile then I think they stop you on the spot, not just send a NIP ?
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MaFt
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Joined: Aug 31, 2005
Posts: 14173
Location: Bradford, West Yorkshire

PostPosted: Sun Sep 01, 2019 6:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I would highly recommend signing up to the forums at Pepipoo - loads of legal people there who can advise.

http://forums.pepipoo.com/
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b33jay
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Joined: Apr 05, 2012
Posts: 196

PostPosted: Mon Sep 02, 2019 11:23 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Kremmen wrote:
Agree.

I may drift over the limit from time to time but never anywhere near 49 in a 30.

Is there a 50 to 30 speed change where a camera may have trapped you as you were just throttling back.

If it was a hand held mobile then I think they stop you on the spot, not just send a NIP ?



A stop is not necessary. Handheld (or tripod mounted) cameras can be single manned and a stop may not take place. A traffic car officers with handheld camera on a motorway observation 'mound' are often used to record speeders including those on the opposite carriageway or on both carriageways from a bridge.
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