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Joined: Dec 27, 2006 Posts: 998 Location: South Lincs, UK.
Posted: Mon May 04, 2009 8:33 am Post subject:
Now using IE7:
Page renders correctly.
Hovering over the ? displays help text as intended but some of the help text for "Camera ID", "Type" and "Details & Description" is lost off the right hand side of the screen. I am using a resolution of 1024x768 on a laptop.
The bottom horizontal border of the help box for "Details & Description" is missing, I don't think any text is missing from the help box, the last line I can see says "otherwise your submission may be rejected."
The blue pushpin on the map is not being rendered correctly. It shows as a dotted outline of the correct shape with a box inside it containing something that looks like a letter J.
It would be really nice if clicking on a camera icon on the map could put the camera ID into the "Camera ID" box rather than just displaying it above the map. If it also automatically AutoFilled the Current Values when you clicked the camera icon on the map this would be perfect.
If the "Find location" finds more than one possible match (I searched for "Main Road" to try it) clicking on any of the locations listed under "Did you mean:" returns you you to the site home page. _________________ Paul
MaFt, I hope you don't mind but I have PM'd you directly with our full “Submit a New Camera Experience”. It was too long to post here. I have, however, listed the salient points which, hopefully, will draw comment from other beta testers.
The remit was to pretend we were a first time submitter of a speed camera, and report back on how easy/enjoyable/annoying the experience was.
With this in mind I experimented, made a few notes and then asked my three teenage children (very techie orientated and never seem to be without a keyboard or console of some description in their hands), who have never visited your the PGPSW website before, to submit a fictitious speed camera outside their best friends house. The following are suggestions based on our experiences.
Suggestion (A) is to provide a direct link to the Camera Submissions Page at the TOP of the Home page in a very prominent position.
Suggestion (B) - Relegate the “Camera ID” from first position to third Position. Rename it with words such as “ Camera ID (if known), or, (Experienced Users Only)nly) anything to let the first time user aware that this is not important to them.
Make “Action” the first choice. It's reassuring and obvious.
Make “Find a Location” the second choice..
Make “Camera ID” the third choice (with the previously mentioned wording advising that it's not absolutely necessary).
Make the fourth line the “FIND” &/or the “AutoFill Current Values” button(s). This should also be the instruction to refresh the page, display the map and to centre it on the screen automatically.
Suggestion (C) - When opening GoogleMaps, open it at “level 4 or 5” and change the wording about dragging and dropping the map to something like “ Double click on the map to position the Blue Pin at the location of the camera you are submitting. Continue to double click until the Blue Pin is positioned correctly”. I know this is mentioned at point 3 beneath the map,but, as this is the most efficient way for a first timer, it should be Numero Uno.
WARNING – At this point my children have had enough and wouldn't bother to continue. It is too much hard work navigating through, up and down and working out where they should go next. They are getting bored.
Suggestion (D) – Move the “Update Co-Ordinates For Single Submission” button to beneath the map, between the red type about greyed out cameras and the emboldened search tips. Re-Name it something simple like “NEXT”. This should refresh the page and centre it on the Compass Rose.
Mild Suggestion (E) - “Grey Out” the Latitude and Longitude boxes. No user data to be entered here (unless some submitters actually come to this point to enter their data!).
Suggestion (F)- Change the title of the “Heading” box to “Direction of Travel”. To the right of the compass rose insert wording such as “ Double click on the direction of the compass which is the same as the direction of the road where your new camera is”. This wording to be permanently displayed and not in a pop-up “Help” window.
Suggestion (G) - “Direction” title change to “Camera Direction”.
Suggestion (H). - Beneath the “Send Entry” box. If these are to proceed to add another new camera submission, say so, or more simply, replace the hotch-potch of boxes and words with a box to click which says “Submit Another Camera Location” and link it to near the top of the Submissions page where the first “Select Country” drop down box is. NOTE: this is a left-over for verifiers/team etc that was originally under the old map position - MaFt
Hope you find these observations helpful and not too damning. They are not intended to be negative. Regards, AliOnHols. _________________ Garmin Nuvi 2599
Android with CamerAlert, OsmAnd+, Waze & TT Europe.
TomTom GO 730, GO 930, GO 940 & Rider2.
SatMap Active 10 & 20.
MaFt, About the left over verifiers boxes, presumably these will be deleted? Suggest you install two extra buttons in their place.
One to "Submit Another Camera".
the other to
"Return to the Main Home Page"
Buena suerte amigo! _________________ Garmin Nuvi 2599
Android with CamerAlert, OsmAnd+, Waze & TT Europe.
TomTom GO 730, GO 930, GO 940 & Rider2.
SatMap Active 10 & 20.
Joined: Jun 04, 2005 Posts: 19991 Location: West and Southwest London
Posted: Tue May 05, 2009 6:31 pm Post subject:
Late onto this topic, but excellent suggestions above!
If it can be included in any of the improvements I would like to see a couple of things
1. The Line of text where the camera ID is displayed and the "Update submission form with camera details" link need to be much more obvious. (although if Alionhols suggestion of entering the ID directly into the box is possible, it makes this irrelevant)
2. When you "Update co-ordinates" on a 1024x768 screen you cannot see the co-ordinates boxes at the same time to visually check that anything has actually been updated.
It would be much better if you could see the whole map AND the form boxes at the same time - there's a strip down the right hand side that would have room for them.
3. I still think the blue "pushpin" in the centre is too big, meaning that if you want to zoom in on the map by double clicking you have to avoid the centre of the screen, so you end up sort of "skirting round" the area you want to get to!
4. The grey panel at the top of the current page doesn't mention the map at all. It should direct new users to the map BEFORE they are presented with the form to fill in.
Joined: Apr 04, 2006 Posts: 10118 Location: Bexhill, South Sussex, UK
Posted: Wed May 06, 2009 10:22 am Post subject:
Further to my previous, a couple more constructive comments, and appologies for any duplications.
Camera ID help does not tell the user how to get a cam ID for an existing cam. It pretty much just repeates the text already displayed. There have been several questions along the lines of 'From where do I get the camera ID' asked at various times.
Help buttons. When you hover over any of the help buttons. IE displays the alt text?(I think it's called) over the top of your help text making some of it impossible to read unless you wait for the alt text to go away. Perhaps get rid of the alt text or keep the alt text as a short help, and users have to click on the help button to popup the extra help (Would popup stoppers allow this?). At present, clicking on the help button in frustration to get rid of the alt text, makes the page jump to the top. Not at all helpfull.
LatLong help. The help says the button is called 'Update_coordinates' The button is no longer called this. In this help, the pin both Green and Blue. It looks pretty blue to me
Locating the exact spot. I find that the double click method is OK to approximately get the position (I didn't know that it did that), But once the pin is approximately right, then dragging is probably the best method of accurately positioning the bottom of the PIN to the middle of the carriageway. The help above the map says 'Then double-click to zoom in and center the map so that the blue pin marks the location of the camera. Note you can also 'slide' the map by left-clicking and dragging it so that the pin is in the correct location' But the lat/lon help does not indicate the latter method.
Submission heading accuracy. I dont suppose it's possible to superimpose a compass rose ( a simple one with just lines, rather than the rather swish one as at present), on the Pin is it? rather than have the compass rose separated by a scroll from the map, this would probably improve the heading in submissions
Make the form less vertical. I still think that making the form flatter, by using multiple fields on a line would save scrolling up and down for those with lower resolutions. (Me on my laptop)
Joined: Jun 04, 2005 Posts: 19991 Location: West and Southwest London
Posted: Wed May 06, 2009 11:38 am Post subject:
M8TJT wrote:
Make the form less vertical. I still think that making the form flatter, by using multiple fields on a line would save scrolling up and down for those with lower resolutions. (Me on my laptop)
That's what I meant when I said try to put the form down the side of the map, to fit as much as possible on one screen. Doing things on the map and then having to scrolll up to see if anything has happened in the boxes is confusing.
Joined: Aug 31, 2005 Posts: 15138 Location: Bradford, West Yorkshire
Posted: Wed May 06, 2009 1:32 pm Post subject:
some comments:
help hover boxes now moved further left so doesn;t 'hang' off the right hand side
yes, ie8 sucks - though blame microsoft and not me ;)
i think i might 'unhide' the map as it will only cause confusion...
"The bottom horizontal border of the help box for "Details & Description" is missing" now fixed!
note that in firefox when you click on a camera icon on teh map it will show an option of 'fill out the form with the cameras details' - however it is a beast to try and code and actually only works in firefox... doesn;t work in safari or ie. i managed to get the text to appear once but the code for actually filling out the form then failed to work...
"If the "Find location" finds more than one possible match (I searched for "Main Road" to try it) clicking on any of the locations listed under "Did you mean:" returns you you to the site home page."
from memory this is an issue with IE and also realtes to google constantly changing their code... it's hacked to death to get it to work but then they change it quite a bit... better off just putting 'street name, town'
"Suggestion (B) - Relegate the “Camera ID” from first position to third Position. Rename it with words such as “ Camera ID (if known), or, (Experienced Users Only)nly) anything to let the first time user aware that this is not important to them."
if a camera id is entered and the form 'auto-filled' then this will change the action accordingly - either to mobile seen again or change. if action was first then a user would set it to change, select a mobile site then it would be changed again... tho i have added text to say when camera id should be used.
text about getting the correct location has been updated
"Suggestion (D) – Move the “Update Co-Ordinates For Single Submission” button to beneath the map, between the red type about greyed out cameras and the emboldened search tips. Re-Name it something simple like “NEXT”. This should refresh the page and centre it on the Compass Rose. "
done - but 'accept this location' rather than 'next'
"Mild Suggestion (E) - “Grey Out” the Latitude and Longitude boxes. No user data to be entered here (unless some submitters actually come to this point to enter their data!). "
done
"Suggestion (F)- Change the title of the “Heading” box to “Direction of Travel”. To the right of the compass rose insert wording such as “ Double click on the direction of the compass which is the same as the direction of the road where your new camera is”. This wording to be permanently displayed and not in a pop-up “Help” window. "
changed to 'heading / direction of travel'. you only need to single click the direction though ;) i will add some text to explain what it is for!
"Suggest you install two extra buttons in their place. One to "Submit Another Camera"."
after submission you have a link that takes you back to the form
"Return to the Main Home Page"
just use main menu at top?
"2. When you "Update co-ordinates" on a 1024x768 screen you cannot see the co-ordinates boxes at the same time to visually check that anything has actually been updated. "
i'm gonna remove some of the text from the map area so you will be able to see a bit more. alos, at the time you wrote this, you will have had some extra 'verifiers' text above the map
"3. I still think the blue "pushpin" in the centre is too big, meaning that if you want to zoom in on the map by double clicking you have to avoid the centre of the screen, so you end up sort of "skirting round" the area you want to get to! "
yeah, i'm thining i might shrinkify it a bit...
"4. The grey panel at the top of the current page doesn't mention the map at all. It should direct new users to the map BEFORE they are presented with the form to fill in."
nah, the logical process to me is: hello, what would you like to do? i'd like to add a camera. OK, so, where is the camera? here, i'll show you on the map. hence action before map.
"Help buttons. When you hover over any of the help buttons. IE displays the alt text"
i'll remove this
"(Would popup stoppers allow this?). At present, clicking on the help button in frustration to get rid of the alt text, makes the page jump to the top. Not at all helpfull. Sad"
the tool tips aren;t pop-ups as such. they are hidden html that when you hover over the area they appear. the link is to '#' - pretty certain this is needed in order for the tooltips to work - you need to link to 'something'! the idea is that when you hover over it the tooltip appears so there's no need to click anything. i should be able to change the cursor so it doesn;t look like a link though!
"LatLong help. The help says the button is called 'Update_coordinates' The button is no longer called this. In this help, the pin both Green and Blue. It looks pretty blue to me"
oops! i'll fix this!! copy n paste from the poi's page ;)
" The help above the map says 'Then double-click to zoom in and center the map so that the blue pin marks the location of the camera. Note you can also 'slide' the map by left-clicking and dragging it so that the pin is in the correct location' But the lat/lon help does not indicate the latter method. "
again, will add this somewhere
"Submission heading accuracy. I dont suppose it's possible to superimpose a compass rose ( a simple one with just lines, rather than the rather swish one as at present), on the Pin is it? rather than have the compass rose separated by a scroll from the map, this would probably improve the heading in submissions "
in theory yes, but see andy_p's previous point about the size of the marker - the bigger the marker the more map is covered and un-clickable...
"Make the form less vertical. I still think that making the form flatter, by using multiple fields on a line would save scrolling up and down for those with lower resolutions. (Me on my laptop)"
this was actually a concious decision to make it flow downwards. to me it makes it more obvious as to the order of things. with fields ont eh left and right it may not be obvious as to the order of things to be filled in. also, on a layout point of view, it looks neater going straight down as all the tool-tip ?'s can be in line etc etc
Joined: Mar 01, 2005 Posts: 1513 Location: West Mids
Posted: Wed May 06, 2009 4:16 pm Post subject:
Minor points...
The text in the "heading" balloon and next to the compass needs editing to refer to the new location of the compass. ie "below" and "right".
Also, the "Country" entry at the bottom of the page could do with a balloon to say how to change it (ie at the top of the page) unless you've changed the code so that it can be changed here as well.
In the "Speed" balloon, it should be "km/h", not "KPH". Probably always like this but this is the first time I've "proof-read" the page.
Why does only the longitude balloon say you "MUST use the Google map" and not the latitude one?
Finally, have you done something in the last 30 mins or so? For the first time, the map appeared on this PC but it's gone again now. _________________ Gerry
TomTom730T
Cameralert for Android
Brodit ProClip mount
Joined: Jun 04, 2005 Posts: 19991 Location: West and Southwest London
Posted: Wed May 06, 2009 4:35 pm Post subject:
Looking much better!
A few thoughts:
1. The first thing a newbie sees is the Camera ID box. Could the help text for that (or the text immediately above the box) mention that you can find the ID number by clicking on the camera's icon on the map?
2. The line of text immediately above the map with the ID number and the "Update submission form with camera details" link still a bit insignificant.
If it can't be made biggers or stand out more, could the link at least be renamed to something like "Click here to update the form with this camera's details"
3. I think I remember reading that devices that can use heading data have a "capture window" of something like 15 degrees? But the clickable feature of the compass only goes in 22 degree steps. Is that OK?
4. Now POI capture is dead, is anyone still submitting ov2 files?
Joined: Aug 31, 2005 Posts: 15138 Location: Bradford, West Yorkshire
Posted: Wed May 06, 2009 5:29 pm Post subject:
GerryC wrote:
Minor points...
The text in the "heading" balloon and next to the compass needs editing to refer to the new location of the compass. ie "below" and "right".
Also, the "Country" entry at the bottom of the page could do with a balloon to say how to change it (ie at the top of the page) unless you've changed the code so that it can be changed here as well.
In the "Speed" balloon, it should be "km/h", not "KPH". Probably always like this but this is the first time I've "proof-read" the page.
Why does only the longitude balloon say you "MUST use the Google map" and not the latitude one?
Finally, have you done something in the last 30 mins or so? For the first time, the map appeared on this PC but it's gone again now.
all done - but not changed anything with the map?
EDIT: forgot to mention that you have always been able to change the country on that bottom bit ;) the top one just reloads the page/map at the correct country location.
Last edited by MaFt on Wed May 06, 2009 5:33 pm; edited 1 time in total
Joined: Aug 31, 2005 Posts: 15138 Location: Bradford, West Yorkshire
Posted: Wed May 06, 2009 5:30 pm Post subject:
Andy_P wrote:
Looking much better!
A few thoughts:
1. The first thing a newbie sees is the Camera ID box. Could the help text for that (or the text immediately above the box) mention that you can find the ID number by clicking on the camera's icon on the map?
2. The line of text immediately above the map with the ID number and the "Update submission form with camera details" link still a bit insignificant.
If it can't be made biggers or stand out more, could the link at least be renamed to something like "Click here to update the form with this camera's details"
3. I think I remember reading that devices that can use heading data have a "capture window" of something like 15 degrees? But the clickable feature of the compass only goes in 22 degree steps. Is that OK?
4. Now POI capture is dead, is anyone still submitting ov2 files?
1 & 2 done
3: i generally try to manually edit the heading on the submission anyway... at the very least we know the rough direction and can edit it appropriately
4: yes, we still get a few users submitting poicapture files. surprisingly there ARE people running navcore 5/6!!
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