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AirCooledHeaven Occasional Visitor
Joined: Sep 01, 2006 Posts: 26
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Posted: Fri Nov 30, 2007 12:14 pm Post subject: S series is pants so an F20 or N20 to replace my 530 ?? |
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Thanks for all the comments about replacing my 530 with an S50, the general negativity about the S series and average reviews elsewhere has put this idea on hold. But I still need updated maps for my 530 and it still looks a sensible idea to buy a new device so I get a later version of smartst too.
The F20 and N20 are both still available for around £150, so what's the difference between them and which should I go for??
TIA |
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Darren Frequent Visitor
Joined: 11/07/2002 14:36:40 Posts: 23848 Location: Hampshire, UK
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Posted: Fri Nov 30, 2007 12:52 pm Post subject: |
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Firstly I should confess that I like TomTom's PND's. I like them because they do the job better than any other I have tried but I'd love a serious competitor to come along and give them a run for their money. I had high hopes for Navman's S-Series but it was not to be.
So I ask have you considered a TomTom? The post here by a convert from Navman to TomTom suggests it may be worthy of consideration? _________________ Darren Griffin |
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AirCooledHeaven Occasional Visitor
Joined: Sep 01, 2006 Posts: 26
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Posted: Fri Nov 30, 2007 1:12 pm Post subject: |
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Darren wrote: | Firstly I should confess that I like TomTom's PND's. I like them because they do the job better than any other I have tried but I'd love a serious competitor to come along and give them a run for their money. I had high hopes for Navman's S-Series but it was not to be.
So I ask have you considered a TomTom? The post here by a convert from Navman to TomTom suggests it may be worthy of consideration? |
Thanks for the link, to be honest I went with Navman originally because I liked the styling compared with the cuboid tom toms of the time, plus 'everyone' was getting a tomtom and I always like to be different to the mainstream. Having said that, the tomtom one with built in traffic for £150 looks great value. So now you've added to my dilemma |
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xtraseller Frequent Visitor
Joined: 15/07/2003 22:59:27 Posts: 1050 Location: United Kingdom
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Posted: Mon Dec 03, 2007 1:53 pm Post subject: Navman |
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You really will not go wrong with the Navman S90i - it is everything a TomTom should be to justify it's sales volume, but is not
Slick, fast operation, excellent clear (and modern) on screen graphics, exceptional volume, superb voice instruction that is detailed and on time. The traffic is excellent
If you could borrow one for a few days, you would never look back |
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Darren Frequent Visitor
Joined: 11/07/2002 14:36:40 Posts: 23848 Location: Hampshire, UK
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Posted: Mon Dec 03, 2007 2:28 pm Post subject: |
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Just shows how opinions vary, I don't think it is anywhere near as good as he equivalent TomTom _________________ Darren Griffin |
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xtraseller Frequent Visitor
Joined: 15/07/2003 22:59:27 Posts: 1050 Location: United Kingdom
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Posted: Mon Dec 03, 2007 2:32 pm Post subject: And... |
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And it is just a well, otherwise we would all be the same and nothing in Sat Nav land would ever progress
Really, if you cannot borrow one of a friend, go in to a store and see the s90i run and then compare to a few others - make your own decision |
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AirCooledHeaven Occasional Visitor
Joined: Sep 01, 2006 Posts: 26
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Posted: Mon Dec 03, 2007 3:09 pm Post subject: |
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Darren wrote: | Just shows how opinions vary, I don't think it is anywhere near as good as he equivalent TomTom |
Darren, in what areas would you say the S series is behind in relation to the equivalent TT product? Value for money? Features? Functionality? Performance? Build quality?
The problem with comparisons is that we all have our own needs and expectations and what fits the bill for one may not be ideal for another.
If the S series is 'better' than the ICN series then that is probably good enough for me, but if retrograde steps have been made then that would be a different matter... |
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Darren Frequent Visitor
Joined: 11/07/2002 14:36:40 Posts: 23848 Location: Hampshire, UK
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Posted: Mon Dec 03, 2007 3:14 pm Post subject: |
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I think the unit 'feels' cheap. It looks OK until you pick it up. The map display is OK but lacks the ability to offer all the info on screen at the same time that I require (Speed, Distance to destination, ETA). You can choose only one of these.
I also find it very slow to acquire a lock and the menu system in unintuitive and in some cases rather illogical.
it's not a bad device, its just not as good as the equivalents from TomTom or Garmin. _________________ Darren Griffin |
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TheM Frequent Visitor
Joined: Mar 21, 2005 Posts: 277
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Posted: Mon Dec 03, 2007 8:59 pm Post subject: |
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Darren wrote: | The map display is OK but lacks the ability to offer all the info on screen at the same time that I require (Speed, Distance to destination, ETA). You can choose only one of these. |
Read the manual. Unlike with N-series, selection strip can stay open on the screen -- just don't select anything, and you have all information on the screen all the time.
Darren wrote: | I also find it very slow to acquire a lock and the menu system in unintuitive and in some cases rather illogical. |
Menu systems generally become logical only once you get used to them -- and then all others are even more illogical. I do agree that some options are placed where you wouldn't expect them, but I never used a system of any kind where everything was where you'd expect.
As far as lock speed is concerned, it doesn't work like on-off switch. Initial lock is always slower but later ones are faster if you use your device frequently. Leave it turned off for a long period of time and lock will be slow again. In my experience S-series has fast lock.
Darren wrote: | it's not a bad device, its just not as good as the equivalents from TomTom or Garmin. |
I swapped my Navman with friend's brand new TomTom One XL for a weekend last month. While unit is solid, it is far from perfect -- there are also illogical things (no buttons on map screen but still tapping on different parts takes you to different menus -- just without reading the manual couldn't quite figure out which part I have to tap to get to the desired menu), bugs (set measurement units to metric but unit soon reverted back to imperial voice guidance even though on-screen values were still metric), poor features (map drag and zoom are a joke), had problems with searching that I don't have on Navman, and there are mapping errors just as on any other unit. It is still a good unit but definitely not better than Navman. I guess in the end it all comes down to personal preference. |
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Darren Frequent Visitor
Joined: 11/07/2002 14:36:40 Posts: 23848 Location: Hampshire, UK
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Posted: Mon Dec 03, 2007 9:05 pm Post subject: |
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TheM wrote: | Read the manual. Unlike with N-series, selection strip can stay open on the screen -- just don't select anything, and you have all information on the screen all the time. |
Thank you for that, my mistake.
Quote: | As far as lock speed is concerned, it doesn't work like on-off switch. Initial lock is always slower but later ones are faster if you use your device frequently. Leave it turned off for a long period of time and lock will be slow again. In my experience S-series has fast lock. |
I'm not inexperienced in such matters, trust me I do know how these things work! (Excusing the obvious issue about reading the manual!
I have compared cold start acquisition against a number of other devices and the S90 is slower in every case, in some cases much much slower. _________________ Darren Griffin |
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TheM Frequent Visitor
Joined: Mar 21, 2005 Posts: 277
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Posted: Tue Dec 04, 2007 8:14 pm Post subject: |
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Darren wrote: | I'm not inexperienced in such matters, trust me I do know how these things work! |
Sorry, I actually wasn't paying attention who I'm replying to.
Darren wrote: | I have compared cold start acquisition against a number of other devices and the S90 is slower in every case, in some cases much much slower. |
Side by side, under the same conditions? How were you testing? Examples?
Did you do GPS reset from UI or were you just power cycling the devices? Not sure about S90, but some of the previous Navman's devices perform GPS reset when power-cycled and some do not, so if you count on GPS always being reset when power-cycled you could get skewed results. |
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Darren Frequent Visitor
Joined: 11/07/2002 14:36:40 Posts: 23848 Location: Hampshire, UK
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Posted: Tue Dec 04, 2007 8:22 pm Post subject: |
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TheM wrote: | Side by side, under the same conditions? How were you testing? Examples? |
S90i, TomTom 720 and a Navigon 7000, all side by side.
Quote: | Did you do GPS reset from UI or were you just power cycling the devices? |
I did warm and cold starts (reset via the UI). It's better under good signal conditions but still slower than the others. In marginal conditions it is consistently slow and this testing was repeatable when using an S30 so excludes the possibility of a faulty unit. _________________ Darren Griffin |
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TheM Frequent Visitor
Joined: Mar 21, 2005 Posts: 277
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Posted: Thu Dec 06, 2007 10:46 pm Post subject: |
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Darren wrote: | S90i, TomTom 720 and a Navigon 7000, all side by side. |
Have you checked how it compares against previous generation Navman devices? |
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xtraseller Frequent Visitor
Joined: 15/07/2003 22:59:27 Posts: 1050 Location: United Kingdom
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Posted: Sun Dec 09, 2007 3:38 pm Post subject: Fast fix |
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My S90i provides an excellent on to fix time of around 30 secs. typically - you just need to remember not to use the on/off button to RESET the unit each time, otherwise I agree, fixes will be longer. But there is no need for this - the Navman software is stable and so dosn't need frequent resets
The unit presents its features better - for me - than any other sat nav unit out there I've tried. More logical, more clearly and more professionally |
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robertn Frequent Visitor
Joined: Feb 06, 2005 Posts: 564
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Posted: Sun Dec 09, 2007 9:03 pm Post subject: |
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I used to think TTFF was everything, waiting for that fix takes a life time, then one day I thought about it a bit more, is TTFF really that important? If you are driving around the corner I can see the point, but the you should really save the planet and walk. Any further, and the time waiting at the first set of traffic lights will make the difference between TTFF's insignificant - given most TTFF are warm starts, not cold starts, it's even less significant.
In the good-old-days TTFF was a good indicator of how reliable the fix would be under less than ideal conditions, but since the advent of SiRF III and others like it, it's not that important, as once fixed, they stay fixed.
So IMHO, useablilty, reliabilty and your own personal preference far outweight the differences in TTFF and Reciever quality in any modern device. |
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