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topgazza
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Location: Hampshire, UK
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 Posted: Mon Feb 26, 2007 12:32 pm Post subject: |
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Phil, that last quote from the EULA refers to the code not the software as a constructed solution. It is the responsibility ofanyone holding a license to either remove software from devices to be sold , disable the licence (?), or point out to the purchaser that a licence has to be obtained and that you are not transfering this to the buyer.. The latter is the only "legal" requirement on a user. In some cases software cannot be removed without damaging a device so a get out is allowed. Its a messy area but as long as an individual can demonstrate that they have shown "due dilligence" in this nobody can touch them.
I work for a software company...a big one and no, not Microsoft, and whilst I would agree that TT can put all sorts of terms for purchasers there is a clear requirement on them to not make those "unreasonable" or "onerous" in a way that prevents a user having "fair use". However, they can ask, as they have done here, for "reasonable" proof, another tricky definition, that single use is being adhered to. Proof of a device being swapped such as a delivery note or repair document is acceptable and if TT are suggesting it is not then they are wrong at every level. Hardrivn seems to have done that. The delay in sorting this out is a different matter and down to their poor cust service. As someone mentioned...this is an example of why people resort to cracks....not to rip the company off but just for the reasons Hardivn is experiencing.
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TomTom 720
Nokia Lumia 800 with Nokia Maps, iPhone 4S with Apple Maps (sigh) |
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philpugh
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Joined: Dec 28, 2005
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Location: Antrobus, Cheshire
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| Posted: Mon Feb 26, 2007 3:33 pm Post subject: |
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| topgazza wrote: | | Phil, that last quote from the EULA refers to the code not the software as a constructed solution. It is the responsibility ofanyone holding a license to either remove software from devices to be sold , disable the licence (?), or point out to the purchaser that a licence has to be obtained and that you are not transfering this to the buyer.. The latter is the only "legal" requirement on a user. In some cases software cannot be removed without damaging a device so a get out is allowed. Its a messy area but as long as an individual can demonstrate that they have shown "due dilligence" in this nobody can touch them. |
I'm not too sure that it is the source code they are referring to as they wouldn't be supplying that to you under a general EULA. In fact they probably wouldn't be supplying it full stop. I'm sure the courts would consider the application code / map data as 'software'. I know this is a complex area so your interpretation may well be correct.
As to software that is difficult to remove I would take this to mean firmware and be covered under different Ts&Cs. E.g. no supplier of PDAs would expect you to restore the firmware to it's original version prior to selling it. Similarly selling an 'all-in-one' sat nav system would be allowed as, even if you did copy the software from it - it wouldn't necessarily work outside the hardware it was designed for. (Must read the nuvi 660 Ts&Cs  )
Just read them - they are much simpler than TomTom's and makes the distinction between binary code on the machine and the source code. It prevents reverse engineering of the binaries. No mention of re-sale - so I could sell it on when I get fed up with it!
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topgazza
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| Posted: Mon Feb 26, 2007 8:57 pm Post subject: |
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Thats true...
It just goe sto show what a difficult area this is and whether or not TT are within their rights to put such, perceived, restrictive conditions on their softwares use. Consumer market has more "rights" than commercial software and restrictive practices are challenged more often on that basis.
In general the theory is that you can't be held accountable for giving someone the software but they are accountable for using it without license. As for changing devices at will but retaining the use of the software then thats a weird one. Microsoft have/had a similar scheme but are more relaxed about it as they license the software....once...and in practice it is transferable. TT are just going over the top here and they would win more friends if they made it easier to transfer but are understanably paranoid over copies etc
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Mullet
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| Posted: Mon Feb 26, 2007 9:44 pm Post subject: |
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Last edited by Mullet on Mon Jul 09, 2007 1:10 am; edited 1 time in total |
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philpugh
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| Posted: Tue Feb 27, 2007 2:11 pm Post subject: |
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Don't know if it will let you do that without getting a new code as the authorisation code you get from ttcode.com is linked to the TomTom hardware code of your device.
I have upgraded my PDA three times since I have been running TomTom and never had a problem. I just re-authorised the new device each time.
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Mullet
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| Posted: Tue Feb 27, 2007 2:49 pm Post subject: |
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Last edited by Mullet on Mon Jul 09, 2007 1:09 am; edited 1 time in total |
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julianbarker
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| Posted: Thu Mar 01, 2007 7:59 pm Post subject: |
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| jgombos wrote: | | I believe the fair use doctrine enables you to legally install TomTom as you please on whatever device you own. |
I am not sure what you mean by "fair use doctrine" but if you mean the US principle of fair use, that has no application outside the US, and certainly does not apply in the EU. |
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hardrivn
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Joined: Feb 07, 2007
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| Posted: Sat Mar 24, 2007 1:19 pm Post subject: Finally |
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| Just an update on this TT finally did get me a code for the device, unfortunately I am about to upgrade the device and will have to go through all of this again. |
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