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My replacement receiver (with the same firmware as the previous one) is behaving flawlessly so far, but I've only had it for a couple of days so much can still happen...
I couldn't say that I share John's experience of interference from the navigation SW, but it might be because I've been using Navman SmartST most of the time, instead of TomTom. However, in the last couple of days I've been using the replacement receiver together with TomTom 5.0 and it has been working without any problems. Let's hope that it stays that way...
So, I have actually not been able to connect the gradually worsening TTFF peformance of my previous receiver with any specific actions. I've always awaited fix before launching the navigation program. One thing that I did observe was that the receiver became increasingly sensitive to short power losses, like when I started the car engine. If I started the engine after acquiring a fix, the fix would be lost and I would have to wait for several minutes before regaining it (often preceded by a serious of hot and warm resets). This behaviour doesn't occur so far with the new receiver. I typically lose the fix for a couple of seconds directly after cranking the engine (since the voltage of the cig outlet goes down for a very short time), but not more.
Since there are so many GR-213 users out there who share the same, or at least very similar, experiences of bad performance I think it would be more than fair if Holux gave us an explanation to the problem and stated if they have a solution for it. The only information I've got is that there is a later firmware version (V6) available which possibly makes a difference. If Holux would only give me a chance to perform this firmware update myself, it would all become much easier.
Joined: Mar 25, 2004 Posts: 20 Location: Derby, England
Posted: Thu Nov 03, 2005 12:36 am Post subject:
Just installed mine yesterday so I'll check it out and report back any problems
JM-HoluxUK wrote:
Hi,
Thanks to everyone that has posted extra information.
We have received a couple of GR213's back from Craig and these are now being tested.
Is there anyone out there that has got a PDA mount that is permanently powered with the GR213 attached? Are you seeing the same problem?
I have corporate customers that use the GR213 with TomTom software that do not see this problem. The difference is they use hardwired car kits that are permanently powered. They will be stopping and starting the vehicle continously in the line of business but do not have the TTFF issues.
Joined: Sep 24, 2004 Posts: 220 Location: Croydon, United Kingdom
Posted: Thu Nov 03, 2005 12:10 pm Post subject:
uffe73 wrote:
One thing that I did observe was that the receiver became increasingly sensitive to short power losses, like when I started the car engine. If I started the engine after acquiring a fix, the fix would be lost and I would have to wait for several minutes before regaining it (often preceded by a serious of hot and warm resets). This behaviour doesn't occur so far with the new receiver. I typically lose the fix for a couple of seconds directly after cranking the engine (since the voltage of the cig outlet goes down for a very short time), but not more.
I have the latest firmware in my GR 213, and it is hardwired into my BMW's ignition, and I have never had this power loss that you mention Ulf. I had a new very heavy duty battery fitted some months ago, maybe that is why, or maybe hardwired into the ignition doesn't result in power loss/surge like a cig lighter.
Mike _________________ Skoda Columbus and for emergencies: TomTom + iPhone 4 & TomTom car kit
I have the latest firmware in my GR 213, and it is hardwired into my BMW's ignition, and I have never had this power loss that you mention Ulf. I had a new very heavy duty battery fitted some months ago, maybe that is why, or maybe hardwired into the ignition doesn't result in power loss/surge like a cig lighter.
Mike
My replacement receiver is still behaving nicely and I don't get this behavour anymorel Let's hope it stays that way. It shouldn't matter if which car battery you have or if you get a short power loss to the GPS receiver; the fix should only be lost for a couple of seconds, at most. I'm starting to think that the problems we've discussed in this thread might actually be more related to the receiver circuit, i.e the HW, in some units than the software version. A comment from Holux on this would be nice...
Joined: 21/02/2003 11:37:04 Posts: 164 Location: United Kingdom
Posted: Sun Nov 06, 2005 3:01 pm Post subject: Here we go again
My replacement has now started to misbehave, "gone deaf"!
Same problem as previously reported, the receiver is unable to gain an initial fix without a kick with a cold start. Thereafter the sytem is fine until the next time the unit is powered on.
Interestingly enough, whatever software I use to monitor the situation - spGPSView, GPSViewer, or even TomTom - the receiver is seeing 10 to 12 sats, but is not receiving sufficient data to obtain a fix. Logically it seems the memory is retaining basic almanac data so presumably the rechargeable backup battery is working OK. It would be nice to do a complete reset to clear the memory etc but I don't know how to achieve this. A "Factory Start" using spGPSView doesn't seem to help.
I haven't had a chance yet to speak to Holux UK (who supplied the unit) and am sure that they will happily exchange the unit as before. From reading other posts, I can see that some members are already on their 3rd replacement so this may only be a short term remedy.
I would have hoped by now to have read some comment from Holux about this problem. It would appear to be an initialisation problem as it does not seem to affect sytems which are hardwired permanently on. Since I suspect these setups are in the minority, there ought to be a large body of users (worldwide) suffering with this problem!
_________________ John
iPAQ3830 (32MB) PPC2002 ROM 1.20
CF Expansion Pack
Holux GR-213 GPS Mouse (GSW3.1.1 -3.1.00.07 C23B1.00)
Kingston Elite Pro 1 GB CF Card for maps
Viking 512MB SD Card (not used for navigating)
TTNav 5.210 (5430) Maps of W Europe
Ok, now it was my turn to get my 2nd receiver to go deaf. It was working perfectly for about two weeks until yesterday morning when it would simply not get a fix. It now takes at least one cold start to get a fix, and it then needs several minutes before a fix is acquired.
I would be most interested to know which firmware version all of you with troublesome GR-213 receivers have. This is to to know if the latest firmware actually solve the TTFF problem? Does any of you have a more recent firmware than GSW3.1.1_3.1.00.07-C23B1.00 ?
Joined: 21/02/2003 11:37:04 Posts: 164 Location: United Kingdom
Posted: Wed Nov 09, 2005 8:51 pm Post subject:
I had an oportunity to speak with someone at Holux UK, I didn't get their name so I can't quote them directly.
They seem to be investigating this problem and it does appear to be linked to the question of power being intermitently being denied to the system e.g. when cranking the engine etc, as detailed in this thread by Ulf. Apparently this seems to be causing problems to Sirf 3 units but was not a problem for Sirf 2. What MIGHT be happening (they have not reached firm conclusions), is that the stored almanac and ephemera data is being corrupted and the receiver is then searching incorrect locations to receive detailed information for a fix. A subsequent cold start then renews the correct data. I don't know whether this means that the power problems are in effect corrupting the firmware so that the renewed data is then stored in a corrupt form??????
I asked whether Holux's other Sirf3 receivers were similarly affected ( Blue Tooth 236). Apparently this is not a problem since they are battery powered and are probably isolated from power problems by their battery, even when connected to car chargers. If this is the case, then (my own speculation) the development of the Sirf 3 module was geared to BT useage, wired receivers being a subsequent innovation??
No mention was made of the existence of any later firmware than that which is currently available.
As surmised in my recent post, even if I obtained a replacement unit (at this stage), it would probably 'degrade' given similar operating conditions.
Apart from having the my setup hardwired and permanently powered, I see little option at present other than to await developments.
I am sure that Holux will be keen to resolve this problem as soon as possible.
Regards _________________ John
iPAQ3830 (32MB) PPC2002 ROM 1.20
CF Expansion Pack
Holux GR-213 GPS Mouse (GSW3.1.1 -3.1.00.07 C23B1.00)
Kingston Elite Pro 1 GB CF Card for maps
Viking 512MB SD Card (not used for navigating)
TTNav 5.210 (5430) Maps of W Europe
Joined: Sep 24, 2004 Posts: 220 Location: Croydon, United Kingdom
Posted: Wed Nov 09, 2005 9:04 pm Post subject:
As mentioned before, I have the latest firmware in mine which I have now had for approx. 2 months now.
So far no problems with TTFF.
I do have a lead without the Rx which means that Tom Tom can not force a reset. Since fitting this I have always got a fix within a minute. :D _________________ Skoda Columbus and for emergencies: TomTom + iPhone 4 & TomTom car kit
That's interesting information you've got. I guess we've paid the price for trying out new technology before it has been tested enough. I would be very interested to hear if mouse GPS receivers from other manufacturers suffer the same problem.
If Holux can't solve the problem with GR-213 I expect to get the money back so that I can get another receiver that is working according to the specifications.
As mentioned before, I have the latest firmware in mine which I have now had for approx. 2 months now.
Mike,
"Latest firmware" is a standard term that some manufacturers seem to be using these days. According to my information from Holux in Taiwan there is a firmware available that is more recent than GSW3.1.1_3.1.00.07-C23B1.00. They refer to it as V6, but I don't know what GSW number that corresponds to. That's why I'm asking you to read out your firmware version number so we can see if the firmware version actually makes any difference. Apparently your receiver is working fine and there must be a reason explaining why a number of customers have problems with TTFF.
Joined: Sep 24, 2004 Posts: 220 Location: Croydon, United Kingdom
Posted: Wed Nov 09, 2005 9:42 pm Post subject:
Hi Ulf
I have no way of telling if I have the lastest firmware as I do not use PC's with my GPS. Holux do not supply any software for Palm OS so I can't do what you all do, nor do I understand what you are talking about most of the time-to a palm user you talk in a foreign language!
When I spoke to Holux a while back, they told me that from the serial no. I gave them that I had the latest firmware. I can only trust them!
I have no way of attaching my GPS to a PC, as my lead has a RJ11 plug on the end. _________________ Skoda Columbus and for emergencies: TomTom + iPhone 4 & TomTom car kit
I have no way of telling if I have the lastest firmware as I do not use PC's with my GPS. Holux do not supply any software for Palm OS so I can't do what you all do, nor do I understand what you are talking about most of the time-to a palm user you talk in a foreign language!
When I spoke to Holux a while back, they told me that from the serial no. I gave them that I had the latest firmware. I can only trust them!
I have no way of attaching my GPS to a PC, as my lead has a RJ11 plug on the end.
Ok, we'll see if someone using the GR-213 with PPC or PC has a better chance of finding the firmware version no.
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