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Roadhawk in-car camera GPS and black box system
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zzf00l
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Joined: Jul 17, 2006
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 13, 2009 11:20 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Brilliant.. how difficult would it be to make it a true 'Black Box' and record the details such as turn signal use/brake light illumination/whether dipped headlights were on etc... very pertinent if used as evidence in court !!
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Darren
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 13, 2009 11:27 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Very easy. Since 2002 every vehicle has been fitted with an OBDII vehicle diagnostics port.

The range of data measured is amazing, running to hundreds of parameters and so it would only take a small modification to have this data stored alongside a GPS location.
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BrianCollison
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Location: Whitley Bay, UK

PostPosted: Fri Nov 13, 2009 11:28 am    Post subject: Roadhawk Reply with quote

Bus companies have 4 cameras on the outside of the bus one at the front, one at rear, and on the sides they have one pointing down the side of the bus pointing to the rear, and on the other side they have it near the rear pointing to the front, thereby having an all round view. These buses run all day, and the recording is tranferred to a main computer every night. There is a monitor in the cab of the bus, which is on all the time automatically switching to each camera in turn, or you can set it fixed on one camera and then just pressing a button to change camera. (It does record all views)

Obviously this is a very expensive system, but it does show what is possible, for recording, it went onto a hard drive in the bus, but I do not know how big that hard drive is. Also it records date and time,
I don't know if it has gps as well.

If you look at a modern bus, you will see the domed cameras on the outside of the bus, the buses I drove have 11 cameras on each bus, these other cameras were on the inside, watching driver and passengers.

Talk about big brother, it was like having the boss looking over your shoulder for the whole shift. I am retired now, I was one of those drivers that was always running late because of traffic and getting wrong for being late.

Brian
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SpikeUK
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 13, 2009 11:29 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

On reviewing this thread from the begining, someone has reminded me that I offered to do a review of the T-eye. Maybe it's time I got on and did it!
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BrianCollison
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 13, 2009 11:37 am    Post subject: Roadhawk Reply with quote

zzf00l wrote:
Brilliant.. how difficult would it be to make it a true 'Black Box' and record the details such as turn signal use/brake light illumination/whether dipped headlights were on etc... very pertinent if used as evidence in court !!


In addition to the cameras on these new buses they do all of the above as well, turn signals, brakes, throttle, lights, these are all recorded with the video. So there is a computer on the bus doing all this recording.

Brian
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Darren
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 13, 2009 11:41 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

A question raised in the other thread about the van driver using GPS data to prove innocence in speeding charge asked about possibility of HDOP and number of satellites in view being added to the desktop software.

I've asked Roadhawk and they will discuss with developers about this and the possibility of file names having Date/Time included but they did point out that hovering over this in the display will reveal number of satelites in view:


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Darren
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 13, 2009 11:42 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

SpikeUK wrote:
On reviewing this thread from the begining, someone has reminded me that I offered to do a review of the T-eye. Maybe it's time I got on and did it!

That would be very welcome, if you can send a write-up with photos etc to me I'll create a page for it and lay it out for you.
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BKM
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 13, 2009 1:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Isn't this the same unit as I got from drivers-eye.com for £195?

If so they work great and I have them installed in all three of my vehicles.
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Darren
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 13, 2009 1:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yes, same device. It can be found under a number of different names. Same hardware but the supplied accessories vary from brand to brand.
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mostdom
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 13, 2009 1:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Darren wrote:
Do T-eye state the video recording resolution and FPS?


Found this-
T-eye wrote:
T-Eye Automated Driving Recorder ADR-3000 Specification:

Camera:
Resolution - VGA (640 x 480)
Lens Angle - 170 degree (Total: 340 degree)

Video:
Compression type - M-JPEG
Recording Size - VGA (640*480)
Frame rate - Max 16 frames /sec@VGA
Recording time - Max 64 mins with 2GByte SD card provided. Larger card will provide more recording
Storage device - SD Memory Card 2gb included. Device can take up to 8GB card.


Found here
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HERE LIES PND May it rest in peace.
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Darren
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 13, 2009 1:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks so it does have a slower frame rate, the RH-1 is 640x480@30fps or you can have a higher resolution image of 1280x960@5fps
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croydesurf
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 13, 2009 3:16 pm    Post subject: Re: RoadHawk Reply with quote

DennisN wrote:
Murdoc wrote:
My question would be is this device approved in any way/by anyone, videos can be fiddled with so would the data be admissible in a British court?
I like the idea of it, but if itís not admissible then it's an expensive gadget.

Welcome Personally, for me the question about admissible in court doesn't matter, I merely want it for recording my travels, with the special benefit it will help me with Verifying PGPSW speed camera sites - I don't have to prove it to myself.

No more expensive than any other video cameras, no more or less admissible than them too? We currently have various videos being used as some form of evidence, including mobile phone videos. They may not be graven in stone, but certainly prompt serious consideration. As for "alterable", I'd think altering a moving video is a different proposition from altering a still photo - I can fiddle in a very amateur way with a jpeg, but I wouldn't have the faintest idea how to start changing a video to lie about the events filmed. Sure, cut out some scenes, but not change the sequence to show me driving like an angel as I cut you down!


From my experience as a police officer, provided the SD card is secured as evidence along with a master and working copy CD of the footage, and you can show continuity throughout the handling process, your footage could be used in court as evidence. If necessary, the court could always get the SD card examined to show whether it has been tampered with.

I know that when we moved to digital recorders in the Roads Policing vehicles, over the old VHS systems there were lots of concerns that the footage could be tampered with. I know my force spend alot of money on a computer system that secures the footage so that you cannot adapt it in anyway shape or form. We have never had anyone get off any offences yet on the basis that the footage is digital.

I hope this helps.

Mark
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Darren
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 13, 2009 3:28 pm    Post subject: Re: RoadHawk Reply with quote

croydesurf wrote:
From my experience as a police officer, provided the SD card is secured as evidence along with a master and working copy CD of the footage, and you can show continuity throughout the handling process, your footage could be used in court as evidence. If necessary, the court could always get the SD card examined to show whether it has been tampered with.

I know that when we moved to digital recorders in the Roads Policing vehicles, over the old VHS systems there were lots of concerns that the footage could be tampered with. I know my force spend alot of money on a computer system that secures the footage so that you cannot adapt it in anyway shape or form. We have never had anyone get off any offences yet on the basis that the footage is digital.

One of the selling points of the Roadhawk is that the data is secured in a special format that cannot be edited, altered or tampered with whilst retaining that format.

This has been implemented with a view to its usage in evidence so it should be acceptable as you suggest. The film can be exported to more usual formats but then it is not secure.

So if a copy is submitted in a common format for viewing by the court along with the original footage/data in its unmodified/secure format that should satisfy the courts.
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Darren
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 13, 2009 5:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

With regards to the question of recording times Roadhawk have replied with some info in that regard.

I have added that as a table to the RH-1 review. They also confirm that the RH-1 will accept SDHC cards of up to 32GB capacity.

Using the table it would be safe to assume that a 16GB card running VGA at 25fps could record over 20hrs of continuous video before it was full.
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BigPerk
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 13, 2009 5:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I notice that the RH can swivel - can it go as far as 180 degrees (ie facing the back window)? Just in case you were still alert enough after a rear-end shove to do it to get at least SOME evidence.
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