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The PGPSW database is called a 'Speed camera Database' NOT 'Clean Licence database. As such, and by definition, it includes Speed cameras. You know, the cash cows that others may laughingly call 'Safety Cameras'.
If you go into London, or drive a large vehicle, then ANPR cameras will seek you out.
Which is EXACTLY to say, er, exactly what I said, about the Editorial/Site Owner possible view of the site, but NOT necessarily that of the userbase (read paying customer base) ** - and even then maybe, STILL what I was saying, as I too said standard ANPR cameras do not have aplace here, as Darren convinced me after his thoughts once before. Ney, I relate more to the Enforcement cameras, and those which, with inclusion in a database, might help promote safer or better driving sometimes too.
I can't state it clearly enough, because I am happy to be one of the few perhaps to be honest about it I admit, but as simple as it gets, let me say, that anything, yes anything, that this site can do, to help me keep my licence clean, is something I WOULD want to ultimately see here - especially if most of these things would also lead to or encourage safer driving.
But certainly it does not need to be EXCLUSIVELY Speed Camera based - not when this site is the market leader as it stands now, and surely the last thing desired is an open market for another site to offer something we here would be missing.
And exactly as bmuskett says, no it's NOT solely Speed Camera, we include redlight camera too.
More than mindful that words NEVER convey tone, let me say resoundingly however, that not a shred of what I have just wrote, is said with a raised voice, an authoritarian tone, or anything like that.
It's just an opinion of one single customer - and might well not even be the view of others.
I just think that as the leading site by far as it stands now, and anticipating the scope for newer cameras of various sorts, types, and enforcement opportunities (read money making schemes if you will), for the future, THIS site is surely the best placed to cover them, having the massive head start it holds already over the inferior competition.
And let me be crystal... Looking around the site right now as I type this, what can I see, as indicators...
Well I see the very title of it, Pocketgpsworld - thus simply indicating its for all stuff GPS based.
So that's not the right avenue, so let me look down another...
Big yellow globe logo at the side, the shortcut so many of us use for the database page... and what does that say...? SPEED CAMERA Database - and we already know that's not exactly factually correct or exclusive as to what it is.
So no, there is nothing, as such, that precludes the site for including WHATEVER data it wishes in the Database, save a will and desire from the powers that be (and of course, a relevance or fair reason for inclusion of whatever new aspect comes).
Unrelated stuff, would be foolish.
But anything that can cost us points and lead to enforcement, or anything that can encourage safer driving, has to be at least CONSIDERED in the future to come, for inclusion (as long as it is not rewarding illegal driving, such as ANPR detection of Uninsured Drivers would be) No, I mean inclusion of aspects that can help save us woes, but by encouraging a safer, or legal, aspect of driving perhaps, in some way.
Again, this is merely the opinion, of one single customer, nothing more though, is not said, in any way tersely, rest assured, and is only offered to promote the healthy debate mentioned earlier.
I only hope you are happy with the way I have presented it, and don't feel I have wronged in any way mate.
Joined: Feb 10, 2008 Posts: 22 Location: Calgary, CANADA
Posted: Mon Jun 02, 2008 1:16 am Post subject:
bmuskett wrote:
But it also includes redlight cameras, which I think is questionable. I for one don't need to be warned about whether it might be "safe" to take a traffic light late.
Hi All;
I just recently subscribed to the speed camera database. I'm in Canada, and we're not quite as far along the Big Brother path as the UK and Europe (although I can see we'll be catching up soon). At the present time here in Calgary, the only fixed site cameras we have are Red Light cameras (they recently changed the rules to allow them to be used for speeding through the intersection on green also).
I actually subscribed to the database to get the speed cameras for an upcoming Europe trip. To my surprise I find that the red light camera sites in my city are included in the DB so I am using them.
I have to disagree ( in a friendly way of course) with bmusketts feelings about the warnings for red light cameras. I don't ever want to go through a red light late and I know most people don't. Having said that I also know that peoples attention sometimes wanders such as when they are on the cell phone. Just last week an aquaintence of mine was killed by a driver going through a red light. I think that anything that will warn me to be extra cautious or getting a drivers attention back to the job at hand is a good thing. I don't consider this database to be a way to keep my license clean. I see it as a way to keep myself alive. If I save some money along the way so much the better.
On a more mundane note:
mikealder wrote:
The links I provided to the LEZ Zone information site will explain all about the idea and how it is being implemented, a camera as such will not detect emissions, but ANPR linked to the DVLA system will provide details of a specific vehicle and whether it should be charged to be at that specific point on the road.
I guess they are employing mobile sites to cover roads that go in to the LEZ zone that are currently devoid of static (fixed) cameras employed for LEZ enforcement - Mike.
Could someone please explain to me LEZ, ANPR and DVLA
EDIT: OK I think I've got LEZ. - Low Emission Zone.
Cheers _________________ Mike
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Last edited by Continental_Drifter on Mon Jun 02, 2008 2:49 am; edited 2 times in total
Joined: Mar 15, 2006 Posts: 3219 Location: Windlesham, Surrey
Posted: Mon Jun 02, 2008 1:34 am Post subject:
Continental_Drifter wrote:
I don't consider this database to be a way to keep my license clean. I see it as a way to keep myself alive. If I save some money along the way so much the better.
Couldn't agree more!
Quote:
Could someone please explain to me LEZ, ANPR and DVLA
Joined: Feb 10, 2008 Posts: 22 Location: Calgary, CANADA
Posted: Mon Jun 02, 2008 1:42 am Post subject:
Wow! Quick response. Isn't it like 2:30 in the morning there? That's real dedication.
Thanks for the response. I'll check out the sites and educate myself. _________________ Mike
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Joined: Jan 04, 2007 Posts: 2789 Location: Hampshire, UK
Posted: Mon Jun 02, 2008 9:34 am Post subject:
shadamehr wrote:
But anything that can cost us points and lead to enforcement, or anything that can encourage safer driving, has to be at least CONSIDERED in the future to come, for inclusion (as long as it is not rewarding illegal driving, such as ANPR detection of Uninsured Drivers would be) No, I mean inclusion of aspects that can help save us woes, but by encouraging a safer, or legal, aspect of driving perhaps, in some way.
I'm not really sure what that post was getting at.
As for knowing where ANPR cameras might be, though, would this lead to safer driving?
If those uninsured/unlicensed/untaxed drivers know where these cameras are and take a detour, does that make for safer roads?
It might be argued that NOT knowing where ANPR cameras might be will catch more uninsured/unlicensed/untaxed drivers, thus making roads safer.
Would the addition of ANPR cameras to the database help reduce the number of drunk or otherwise unfit and/or dangerous drivers on the roads? _________________ Andy
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As for knowing where ANPR cameras might be, though, would this lead to safer driving?
NO
Quote:
If those uninsured/unlicensed/untaxed drivers know where these cameras are and take a detour, does that make for safer roads?
NO
Quote:
It might be argued that NOT knowing where ANPR cameras might be will catch more uninsured/unlicensed/untaxed drivers, thus making roads safer.
YES, if you are taxed, have MOT and insured, you have no worries, as the ANPR isn't relevant to you.
Why advertise the ANPR cameras to those illegal drivers, (which us legal drivers have to pay for) so they can can avoid them.
Quote:
Would the addition of ANPR cameras to the database help reduce the number of drunk or otherwise unfit and/or dangerous drivers on the roads?
NO _________________ TomTom Go 60
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Joined: May 12, 2006 Posts: 710 Location: Stockport, Cheshire
Posted: Mon Jun 02, 2008 10:34 am Post subject:
shadamehr wrote:
And exactly as bmuskett says, no it's NOT solely Speed Camera, we include redlight camera too.
You can't use what I say in support of your cause, I don't think they should be in there.
shadamehr wrote:
No, I mean inclusion of aspects that can help save us woes, but by encouraging a safer, or legal, aspect of driving perhaps, in some way.
What else exactly? ANPR is everywhere, I believe the congestion zone is covered by POIs and possibly the LEZ could be too. There are POIs for lots of other stuff. What else? It's a speed camera database, let's leave it at that. It's complicated enough as it is. Look at all the debate over mobiles and which should be included.
shadamehr wrote:
Again, this is merely the opinion, of one single customer, nothing more though, is not said, in any way tersely, rest assured, and is only offered to promote the healthy debate mentioned earlier.
I only hope you are happy with the way I have presented it, and don't feel I have wronged in any way mate.
I've said it before and I'll say it again - forget all the "I don't want to upset people" stuff. If you've got a point to make, just make it, in as few words as possible, and get on with the debate. Personally, all that other waffle inclines me against you whatever you're saying. I see another long post from you and groan.
Joined: May 12, 2006 Posts: 710 Location: Stockport, Cheshire
Posted: Mon Jun 02, 2008 10:47 am Post subject:
Continental_Drifter wrote:
I have to disagree ( in a friendly way of course) with bmusketts feelings about the warnings for red light cameras. I don't ever want to go through a red light late and I know most people don't. Having said that I also know that peoples attention sometimes wanders such as when they are on the cell phone. Just last week an aquaintence of mine was killed by a driver going through a red light. I think that anything that will warn me to be extra cautious or getting a drivers attention back to the job at hand is a good thing. I don't consider this database to be a way to keep my license clean. I see it as a way to keep myself alive. If I save some money along the way so much the better.
But what about all those traffic lights where there aren't redlight cameras? I know what you mean about inattentive drivers but I don't think redlight warnings in the speed camera database is going to help. That would imply we should have an entry for every set of traffic lights. Maybe a set of warning rumble strips on the road 200 yards before every set to wake people up would be a better idea - that wouldn't rely on the driver having a sat nav with the PGPSW speed camera database in it. Where do you draw the line?
And still people would risk going through lights on amber or red because they are too impatient. I say put red light cameras on every set of lights and give them fines and points. They'd soon stop doing it.
Sorry, got into grumpy old man mode for a bit there. Rant over.
Joined: Aug 31, 2005 Posts: 15145 Location: Bradford, West Yorkshire
Posted: Mon Jun 02, 2008 10:59 am Post subject:
we will not be including anpr (tax/mot) sites int eh database, however, if someone collated the data for the low emission zones then i don't see why these could not be added to the poi database in teh same way as the congestion zones are?
.........................but as simple as it gets, let me say, that anything, yes anything, that this site can do, to help me keep my licence clean, is something I WOULD want to ultimately see here...............................But certainly it does not need to be EXCLUSIVELY Speed Camera based..................................So no, there is nothing, as such, that precludes the site for including WHATEVER data it wishes in the Database......................But anything that can cost us points and lead to enforcement, or anything that can encourage safer driving, has to be at least CONSIDERED in the future to come, for inclusion...................
We only want speed cameras, as some one else said it is bad enough with all the complicated mobiles.
My DS talks me through every camera with type/speed/whether i'm too fast/telling me to slow down, sometimes in London it doesn't stop for hours.
I'm already being nagged to death (worse than her in doors) PLEASE KEEP TO SPEED CAMERAS ONLY.
Quote:
It's just an opinion of one single customer - and might well not even be the view of others.
I hope this is only a single view and not the view of others. _________________ TomTom Go 60
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I say put red light cameras on every set of lights and give them fines and points. They'd soon stop doing it.
Red light camera warnings do have their merits in London and other large cities, as often the traffic jams extend into the lights, if you don't creep over the line, you could be sitting there all day!
Having the warning is vital, as for speed jumping, unless it is in the middle of the night average speed is less than 10mph.
Quote:
YES
At all other traffic lights, never mind the fine and points, use automatic 'stingers'.
The shock, disabled motor and the cost of four tyres is better than a fine.
Motorists jumping red lights cause nothing but death and destruction.
I detest sitting at the lights looking at bunches of flowers tied to the railings, you always know that it was a child or teenager, often the death caused by others. _________________ TomTom Go 60
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Last edited by GJF on Mon Jun 02, 2008 11:37 am; edited 1 time in total
we will not be including anpr (tax/mot) sites int eh database, however, if someone collated the data for the low emission zones then i don't see why these could not be added to the poi database in teh same way as the congestion zones are?
MaFt
(Long post Warning to bmuskett, as it answers SEVERAL replies in one go - if you don't like long posts where they are unavoidable, feel free to skip and read the next post, or thread elsewhere, rest assured).
MaFt, Wow, the first sensible answer (to points I raised, not new posters I mean), in here for a bit. to everyone
As we have GPS_Fan arguing against ANPR, which is exactly what I said in the prior two posts too. So he's certainly not arguing with me there
Then Bmuskett saying I can't use red light cameras, to help my case as he doesn't think they should be in.
But whether he thinks they should or not, currently the ARE, so it doesn't HELP my case, it completely PROVES the minor point I was making, that it's NOT solely a SPEED camera Database as the name would imply, that's all
Then he asks me to future gaze by asking me what sort of cameras I mean, even though that's exactly the point - as we are talking of things to come, how the heck is anyone minded to know.
Then finally, he closes of by telling me (despite serious issues in the past on here he clearly knows nothing about) to "forget all the "I don't want to upset people" stuff. If you've got a point to make, just make it, in as few words as possible, and get on with the debate. Personally, all that other waffle inclines me against you whatever you're saying. I see another long post from you and groan."
Proving how completely wrong his point is, because in so saying, he just made me livid with him, due to his arrogant, nasty tone, WITHOUT a "I'm not meaning to upset" or shred of humour or decency - exactly why it is so importnat NOT to be blase as he suggests - not on your nelly.
Quite aside from the fact, given the PM debates you've insisted on having with me in the past, when they only ever stop if I let you have the last word on the matter, it's also as shallow as hell, and in the exact way you say it to me, it "simply inclines me against you whatever you're saying. I see ANY artificially challenging post from you and groan."
Trust that helps, bmuskett though, if you want the last word as usual, by all means PM me, I'll read it, then not respond, giving you the satisfaction you seem to crave, rest assured.
.........................but as simple as it gets, let me say, that anything, yes anything, that this site can do, to help me keep my licence clean, is something I WOULD want to ultimately see here...............................But certainly it does not need to be EXCLUSIVELY Speed Camera based..................................So no, there is nothing, as such, that precludes the site for including WHATEVER data it wishes in the Database......................But anything that can cost us points and lead to enforcement, or anything that can encourage safer driving, has to be at least CONSIDERED in the future to come, for inclusion...................
We only want speed cameras, as some one else said it is bad enough with all the complicated mobiles.
My DS talks me through every camera with type/speed/whether i'm too fast/telling me to slow down, sometimes in London it doesn't stop for hours.
I'm already being nagged to death (worse than her in doors) PLEASE KEEP TO SPEED CAMERAS ONLY.
Quote:
It's just an opinion of one single customer - and might well not even be the view of others.
I hope this is only a single view and not the view of others.
A foolish answer in that you too refer to one user as if that is the exhaustive view, yours and his, forming the way things are - no really read it again - you say "We only want..." That's as definitive as it gets, indicating that this is the view of everyone else.
At least I had the decency to say mine was my OWN view only.
Oh and a in case it's not obvious here.
But on a serious note, it's still the wrong answer in some regards, even from a completely FAIR point of view, in that if some want, and others don't, there is NO need to rule out what those who do want from the database - because in case we forget, the database can be downloaded by TYPE even now.
So there is nothing to stop those who only want certain categories, only downloading them.
Or for those who use the consolidated type, opening the downloaded file up and doing a simple search and replace for any sort of camera they don't want to be warned about, and deleting it.
That's a valid point mate, and I offer it not being argumentative, but in case it is even helpful to you now.
As you claim there is already too much in the database for you. But having all this, I am guessing you are a single file user, else you could have elected only to install those types you DO want to see.
That being the case, hopefully it might help you to know, that if you wish, you can open the file up in notepad etc, and sort on camera name - this will then group them by type, pretty much.
You can then easily highlight and delete any types you DON'T want to be warned about.
And voila - a tailor made database, just the way YOU individually want it.
So everyone happy.
Problem is, if the info is not in in the first place, then those of us who DO want all types, cannot use it.
So my point again, is that by having ALL the maximum info included possible (as long as it's relevant, for sure), then EVERYONE can have things just the way THEY like it individually.
As those that want it all, get it, and those that only want certain stuff, can set it this way, exactly to their own taste.
Hope this helps mate - seriously, I mean even now, from a practical point, if you never realised you could do this.
I am even happy to do the work for you myself, if you explain what sort of cameras you DO want, and I can confirm you are a Life member - believe you are, but as I type this, the summary thread box below stops showing avatars and statuses.
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* - and even then maybe, STILL what I was saying, as I too said standard ANPR cameras do not have aplace here, as Darren convinced me after his thoughts once before. Ney, I relate more to the Enforcement cameras, and those which, with inclusion in a database, might help promote safer or better driving sometimes too.
to everyone
