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We have heard this from Navman for the iCN6xx series, the 510/20, 530, 700 series, F and N series. Theres a recurring theme going on with Navman since their very first iCN630 release. Thge products always need service packs to get fundimental functionality working. The service packs are promised, and if they delivered are usually late, often causing as many problems as they fix.
Personally I don't know if they are better or worse than the compeditors, but why do they ship product that needs service packs, and past history shows they are good at making these promises and not so good at keeping them.
I know I an dumping on them here, but after all the practice they have had with product releases, you would think they could get one right first time - Is it just me, or do others think the overall software quality is below par? Maybe it's just these night shifts......
Joined: Feb 10, 2005 Posts: 1951 Location: Mostly somewhere in Essex
Posted: Mon Dec 03, 2007 7:35 am Post subject:
Even (?) Microsoft issue servicepacks after launch of their products. A Servicepack is due out very shortly for Vista (mainly a package containing all the recent updates), so servicepacks per se are not something we should worry about as they are just the fixes for what is found after launch based upon the public use. I know in a perfect world a product should be perfect but with modern technology is it actually feasible _________________ Gee-Pee
Lifetime member PGPSW - time rapidly decreasing
My Microwave oven, TV, Stereo, DVD/Hard drive recorder have all not needed service packs, niether has the Engine Management Computer, Gearbox management computer, ABS and SRS systems in my cars ever needed service packs. Most things you buy tehse days have computers of one size or another, and most do not need service packs to work.
Why is such a simple (As in one task) device such as a Car Nav system unable to be developed and shipped without faults. I doubt the source code base for the S series (for instance) is 1000'th of the size of the Vista code base, but it seems to have about the same service pack requirment.
1000'th of the size of the Vista code base, but it seems to have about the same service pack requirment.
I'm waiting for Naman's SP2.
I want to be able to buy a new S** Navman because of the recent dropping of the ICN7** range support, but as the INC7** seems to work I'll just wait longer! _________________ Dom
HERE LIES PND May it rest in peace.
Navigon 7310/iPhone Navigon&Copilot
My Microwave oven, TV, Stereo, DVD/Hard drive recorder have all not needed service packs
Then you're very lucky.
Check pages 2-3 of Jack Ganssle's "Great Watchdogs" for Ed VanderPloeg's story about how he had to reset his range hood fan! First paragraph after that story reads:
One developer admitted to me that his consumer products company could care less about the correctness of firmware. Reboot – who cares? Customers are used to this, trained by decades of desktop computer disappointments. Hit the reset switch, cycle power, remove the batteries for 15 minutes, even pre-teens know the tricks of coping with legions of embedded devices.
From my personal experience: I bought first generation Sony HDD recorder when it first came out -- it wasn't cheap by any standards. Turned out software is full of problems but Sony couldn't be bothered to release service pack although they could easily do that. Instead, they released a new range of HDD recorders, cheaper ones and with all problems fixed. I'd be much happier if they released service pack than pretending that nothing is wrong.
And what about game consoles that never needed service packs only two generations ago but now have routinely patches released? The more complicated software becomes, the more likely it is that you'll need to patch it at some point.
robertn wrote:
niether has the Engine Management Computer, Gearbox management computer, ABS and SRS systems in my cars ever needed service packs.
You're comparing apples and oranges here. These systems are built to much different standard of reliability, at much higher cost but also sold in vastly higher volumes so that cost spreads, and there are no new releases every year that must be out just in time for Christmas Season, as happens with all consumer electronic.
Posted: Tue Dec 04, 2007 11:19 pm Post subject: Navman problems
Hi all, I got a S50 from Tesco's - at least I got the points!
The TMC is very hit and miss - even with the maplin magmount.
(see the TMC thread)
Tried the poi's from here, halfway through loading them got the 12000 warning, carried on - suffered next day as the unit did not work - well it took the Navman half of my 40 minute journey to work to calculate the route. In fairness I disabled all of the other poi's before coming home and it is just about up to speed. I used the tom tom audio files for the cameras, converted to wav's and presto some proper audio on the cameras again. It is annoying that you cannot remove the original poi's from the unit - if anyone does let us know please- free up some valuable memory.
Joined: Feb 10, 2005 Posts: 1951 Location: Mostly somewhere in Essex
Posted: Tue Dec 04, 2007 11:58 pm Post subject: Re: The S** series 'problems'
Gee-Pee wrote:
If, like I do, you read the forums regularly, one gets the impression that the S series is fraught with problems, but then it is the tendency to only post when there is a problem.
I am thinking, depending upon the maths, of selling my N20 and getting the top end S model ...(I would have to buy the new E. European maps for the N20 to fulfil my needs - being available from 4th December if I kept the N20), whereas, I understand that the S90i comes with the latest mapping on DVD (?).
So let's hear it from those of you who think the S range is the bee's knees - or otherwise.Should I stay with my tried and tested N20 which works exactly as I want it to or go into the unknown territory of the Sssss.
Well, I did ask for it, didn't I when I started this thread
The update to the N** is due out tomorrow (?) so I guess it is stay with what I have and get the update.....I suppose I am fortunate in having no real problems with this range. So the decision is keep the N20. _________________ Gee-Pee
Lifetime member PGPSW - time rapidly decreasing
Posted: Thu Dec 06, 2007 12:22 am Post subject: Re: Navman problems
nigel54311 wrote:
It is annoying that you cannot remove the original poi's from the unit - if anyone does let us know please- free up some valuable memory.
You need to be comfortable modifying XML to be able to do that -- and I mean comfortable because you know what you're doing, not comfortable because you're too ignorant to be worried.
What you need to do is find a list of stuff that's being loaded and then remove stuff you don't like. Finding that list is quite easy since it's conveniently named mapshigh.xml (I suspect low end devices have mapslow.xml?). Make a backup copy of that file first and then load it into your favourite XML editor. Do a search for "Safety Cameras" to find relevant "dca" sections. Remove "dca" sections for cameras you don't want any more and try your new file -- if something doesn't work you still have your backup copy. Do not mess with anything else on your device!
If after having a look at that file you still have questions -- just give up and don't try anything. These files will be different between individual devices, depending on configuration, so no one can provide you with the replacement file if you damage your own and don't have a backup. If you do go through with this, I think you will also need to restore that backup copy next time you connect to NavDesk.
NOTE: you can remove stuff from there but you cannot add anything -- items in there are loaded only after license has been checked so this is not a way to circumvent copyright protection on maps.
We have heard this from Navman for the iCN6xx series, the 510/20, 530, 700 series, F and N series. Theres a recurring theme going on with Navman since their very first iCN630 release. Thge products always need service packs to get fundimental functionality working. The service packs are promised, and if they delivered are usually late, often causing as many problems as they fix.
Personally I don't know if they are better or worse than the compeditors, but why do they ship product that needs service packs, and past history shows they are good at making these promises and not so good at keeping them.
I know I an dumping on them here, but after all the practice they have had with product releases, you would think they could get one right first time - Is it just me, or do others think the overall software quality is below par? Maybe it's just these night shifts......
#
Totally agree, Navman were very good at promising fixes for GPS units but often just replaced it with a new model instead. The S series units look nice but I know from experience to aviod Navman like the plage. I believe it was the rubbish customer support which lead to the company being sold.
My girlfriend has an S30. We went to a pub and wanted to make it a favourite as we sat in the carpark, and I was flabbergasted that I couldn't see a way of making a favourite of the current GPS. Did I miss something?
My girlfriend has an S30. We went to a pub and wanted to make it a favourite as we sat in the carpark, and I was flabbergasted that I couldn't see a way of making a favourite of the current GPS. Did I miss something?
I hunted the manual to find this on page 30:-
Quote:
How do I save a Favourite or My Home?
1. Search for an address until the Preview screen is displayed.
2. Tap Save.
The New Favourite screen will display.
Hope it helps as it is a little different on older models! _________________ Dom
HERE LIES PND May it rest in peace.
Navigon 7310/iPhone Navigon&Copilot
My girlfriend has an S30. We went to a pub and wanted to make it a favourite as we sat in the carpark, and I was flabbergasted that I couldn't see a way of making a favourite of the current GPS. Did I miss something?
I hunted the manual to find this on page 30:-
Quote:
How do I save a Favourite or My Home?
1. Search for an address until the Preview screen is displayed.
2. Tap Save.
The New Favourite screen will display.
Hope it helps as it is a little different on older models!
Thank you for that help, Mostdom, although I don't think it answers my query. I saw that you can make an address a favourite. I wanted to assign the current GPS position to a favourite. Addresses can be approximate, or they can have errors. In my case the pub was in the middle of nowhere on a country lane, and if I had been able to set a favourite at its carpark that would have been ideal, I was actually at the GPS position that I wanted to make a favourite, so the raw GPS position data was available, but I couldn't make it a favourite. I use Tomtom v5 on a Palm, and there are several types of location, such as addresses, POIs or current GPS, that can be made a favourite, and I was looking for comparable functionality in the Navman. I can now see from the manual that one can only base favourites on addresses in the Navman.
I wanted to assign the current GPS position to a favourite.
If you have a current GPS fix, just switch to map, tap twice on the position you want to save to open the pop-up menu and select "Show Details" -- it will open a screen with address of the selected location which has "Save" button.
tap twice on the position you want to save to open the pop-up menu and select "Show Details"
TheM is probably right. I didn't find this in the manual when I looked but it works the same on the older touch screen models so it would have seemed reasonable that it would work on the newer ones too. On my 750 I find a single tap to get a crosshair on the location you want then tap the crosshair again to bring up the menu works fine too. _________________ Dom
HERE LIES PND May it rest in peace.
Navigon 7310/iPhone Navigon&Copilot
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night shifts......
