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Joined: Apr 04, 2006 Posts: 10118 Location: Bexhill, South Sussex, UK
Posted: Fri Jun 29, 2007 8:01 pm Post subject: TMC Transmissions
I am confused over TMC broadcasters.
I have a C710 running MioMap V3.2 dated Sept 22 2006.
At my present South Coast location (Nr Hastings) I receive TMC from Southern FM, but loose it when I stray away from the transmitter. I have heard that Clasic FM also broadcast TMC, but when I am in a strong Classic FM are, I get no TMC.
I recently 'upgraded' (or whatever) to the (I think) May 07 version of 3.2 and promptly lost my Mio's local TMC facility so 'downgraded' back to the Sep06 version PDQ.
Has anyone got the definative answer as to what's going on?
Trevor
Posted: Fri Jun 29, 2007 9:11 pm Post subject: Re: TMC Transmissions
M8TJT wrote:
I am confused over TMC broadcasters.
I have a C710 running MioMap V3.2 dated Sept 22 2006.
At my present South Coast location (Nr Hastings) I receive TMC from Southern FM, but loose it when I stray away from the transmitter. I have heard that Clasic FM also broadcast TMC, but when I am in a strong Classic FM are, I get no TMC.
I recently 'upgraded' (or whatever) to the (I think) May 07 version of 3.2 and promptly lost my Mio's local TMC facility so 'downgraded' back to the Sep06 version PDQ.
Has anyone got the definative answer as to what's going on?
Trevor
Kind of. Miomap used to support Trafficmaster TMC and thus a range of local stations with Trafficmaster TMC data feeds. On or about November 2006 the data feed license key (a file inside your Mio) changed so that Miomap could only receive TMC transmissions from ITIS - which uses Classic FM (except in some remote locations, such as the Valleys, where Real and other stations ar used).
Anyway, yes, Classic FM TMC reception is a lot worse than the Trafficmaster equivalent in many provincial areas. So much so that I have basically lost TMC functionality within a 20 minute radius of my home.
ITIS say that they are in the process of developing contracts to provide their data feed, where required, via local stations.
For about £60 to £80 (possibly £40 to £50) you can have your car radio adapted via a Y splitter so that you can connect the Mio to the car antenna and, possibly, receive grade A transmissions.
Yes. It seems that the last MioMap 'upgrade' included a change from Trafficmaster to ITIS. Like you Trevor I have reverted to the previous version, and I find the Trafficmaster data to be adequate.
Joined: Apr 04, 2006 Posts: 10118 Location: Bexhill, South Sussex, UK
Posted: Fri Jun 29, 2007 11:37 pm Post subject:
Thanks for that both.
Is the file a separate one that can be changed, or is it embedded into Miomap.exe? Shame you can't use both TM and ITIS
I have a splitter in my car aerial already, but other than asthetic improvements, it does not seem to improve my TMC reception.
Thanks for that both.
Is the file a separate one that can be changed, or is it embedded into Miomap.exe? Shame you can't use both TM and ITIS
I have a splitter in my car aerial already, but other than asthetic improvements, it does not seem to improve my TMC reception.
Hey Ho wat the h***
gudnite
Trevor
No you can't simply replace the ITIS licence file with the Trafficmaster one - you have to downgrade the version of Miomap (which means using the install CD from who has the appropriate version. I don't have one and to be honest I think the bugs in earlier versions of Miomap 3.2 make it too much of a compromise - although there are still bugs a plenty in the current version and no sign of fixes yet).
I think users should be given the choice in terms of subscription to ITIS or TM. Mio doesn't allow user choice in terms of purchasing a subscription and should ITIS goes belly up - unlikely given its recent share performance - or change its business model we wouldn't have a TMC service for Mio devices in the UK.
I'm a bit surprised that the splitter doesn't improve your TMC reception. It seems to be a complicated issue though - apparently if an amplifier is connected to the split feed it can degrade the TMC signal (rather than boost it). A local car radio installer - who also installs built in sat nav systems - has told me that a basic Y splitter should produce a very reliable signal in areas where the FM transmission can be received and that there's little benefit, in terms of TMC signal, in using a dedicated TMC splitter (although a Y splitter may degrade the FM radio signal for the car radio this will only be apparent in fringe areas or when trying to keep a lock on a station outside of its published broadcast range).
Not sure what to suggest. My own experience is that ITIS reception via a shoe string lead is much, much worse than Trafficmaster reception. It would be nice to have the choice but afaik there isn't a single mass market sat nav manufacturer that offers this choice. I hope that ITIS does extend its TMC transmission service beyond Classic FM as it says it is in the process of doing and may have done by the end of the year. Logically, given that Classic FM radio reception is generally no problem, the TMC reception should also be good but it isn't. A distance of a few feet is capable of pushing the reception bar from full to non existent in some areas.
My own experience of Mio and the shoe string lead on the continent is the opposite - in France, Belgium and the Netherlands I often didn't even need the shoe string lead to receive TMC. The unit on its own was capable of doing it. I think the UK provider companies need to get their fingers out and acknowlege that although shoe string lead and in built receivers are pretty poor there's also an issue about transmission services that needs to be addressed.
Joined: Apr 04, 2006 Posts: 10118 Location: Bexhill, South Sussex, UK
Posted: Sun Jul 01, 2007 1:08 pm Post subject:
Retty
I have 'downgraded' to the version of 3.2 that came on the DVD. It's the Sept 22 06 version that seems to use TM (does not get anything from Classic FM).
In your last you speak of the bugs in thie earlier version that have been fixed in the later version. What actually is improved in the later version? I have found that the Speedcam km/h vs. MPH readout was exactly the same, and didn't wait around long enough to look for other 'improvements' because of TMC failure.
My splitter is a simply Y splitter. Although the signal might be a bit better, but subjectively, it ain't 'WOW'
I went to France/Belgium a few weeks ago and got no TMC but I now suspect that's because I'm receiving TM and ITIS is what's transmitted there.
Trevor
I think users should be given the choice in terms of subscription to ITIS or TM. Mio doesn't allow user choice in terms of purchasing a subscription and should ITIS goes belly up - unlikely given its recent share performance - or change its business model we wouldn't have a TMC service for Mio devices in the UK.
That's just not practical - it would require Mitac to buy licences from both service providers to cover possible use of their data by customers.
I understand that Mitac had to change providers, for a very good reason that is best not mentioned here.
M8TJT wrote:
I went to France/Belgium a few weeks ago and got no TMC but I now suspect that's because I'm receiving TM and ITIS is what's transmitted there.
Neither of the UK companies provides data in France/Belgium. You would have been receiving a different service altogether so the UK change wouldn't affect it.
Joined: Apr 04, 2006 Posts: 10118 Location: Bexhill, South Sussex, UK
Posted: Sun Jul 01, 2007 2:12 pm Post subject:
repsaj.
Thanks for that. I understood, perhaps wrongly that Retty took his to France and the TMC worked fine. Perhaps he would like to confirm this and whether it was ITS not TM.
Thanks for your comment on Direction data as well :D
Trevor
repsaj.
Thanks for that. I understood, perhaps wrongly that Retty took his to France and the TMC worked fine. Perhaps he would like to confirm this and whether it was ITS not TM.
Thanks for your comment on Direction data as well :D
Trevor
If you were in Belgium you should certainly have picked up TMC irrespective of the license file and Miomap version date - TMC transmissions in Belgium are subscription free.
The situation for French TMC is more complicated - and more complicated than the situation in the UK. It isn't helped by the lack of English language information on French TMC.
Basically though a French premium TMC feed (V-Traffic) was added to Mio TMC licenses in or around November 2006. Before that time I was only able to pick up basic TMC information when in France (nothing about congestion and just road closures iirc). On subsequent trips - since November 2006 and using the latest software - my experience has been variable. On 1 trip (February) I wasn't able to pick up French TMC at all - not even a free feed. I was able to pick up Belgium TMC near the French/Belgium border. On my last trip (May) I was able to pick up pages and pages of French premium TMC - and pretty good it was too. It puts the UK services to shame.
So, yes, there is a licence file issue with French TMC and the French premium feed was only introduced in or around November 2006. But you should be able to receive TMC in Belgium with no problem.
See however some posts - I don't have the references - in the GPS Passion forums which describe that French TMC feeds are tied to the firmware/ROM version of the Mio device. I'm not convinced by this (why would I be able to receive a premium TMC feed with an older rom version?) but, who knows, there may be something in it.
The main bug with earlier versions of 3.2 consisted of an occasional but annoying lock up where it was necessary to soft reset (and occasionally hard reset) the unit. The bug could be replicated to the extent that certain geographical locations would trigger it. I notice that later versions of 3.2 also suffer a similar bug but that usually the response of the unit is to reboot rather than to lock up. I had to upgrade to a later version of 3.2 because the earlier version was so prone to locking up.
Other than that the voice directions are better with later versions of 3.2 - none of the "turn slightly left" stuff or other counter intutitive voice directions although there is still room for improvement and bends are still mistaken for turns (and turns for bends).
The motorway exit sign also represents the left side exit of UK driving in later versions. A minor point.
With the C710 there are still bugs in the telephony software so much so that it isn't possible to select a name from the telephone list with 1 touch. Mitac has shown no desire to fix firmware bugs with the older series C710. Without firmware updates it seems as if some of the bugs - include the occasional illegal operation reboot bug - won't be fixed.
By the way, it was suggested in this forum a few weeks ago Mio never intended to provide a license file for Trafficmaster and that the TM file was the consequence of a programming or release glitch!
Joined: Apr 04, 2006 Posts: 10118 Location: Bexhill, South Sussex, UK
Posted: Sun Jul 01, 2007 4:37 pm Post subject:
Retty
Thanks for the small booklet on TMC. Very informative.
My Mio occasionally reboots for no apparent reason, but, as yet, I havn't had a lockup.
I have completedly re-hashed the voiced commands in mine, so don't have too many complaints about my friend Phillipa other than I would like to stop her repeating herself so often, especially on the approach to roundabouts. Warnings at 800, 300, 100 and 0 can be a bit tiresome. I have tried messing around with minsilence but no joy yet. I'm still working on it. I have also rehashed the Speedcam audible warnings to a 'once only' announcement of the type of camera, and got the damn thing to display everything correctly in MPH as well.
Joined: Jan 04, 2007 Posts: 2789 Location: Hampshire, UK
Posted: Fri Oct 12, 2007 8:10 am Post subject:
Retty wrote:
Other than that the voice directions are better with later versions of 3.2 - none of the "turn slightly left" stuff or other counter intutitive voice directions although there is still room for improvement and bends are still mistaken for turns (and turns for bends).
The motorway exit sign also represents the left side exit of UK driving in later versions. A minor point.
Some of this stuff seems to be included in the map updates rather than software - if you leave the MioMap in an earleir version and update only the maps, you benefit from "continue straight", "bear right" and a few other instructions including increased warning distances for junctions, roundabouts, motorway exits.
iTIS have announced the introduction of new radio stations into their transmission network (which are due to go live January 2008), but TrafficMaster appear to have done something similar on the quiet.
I have 2 identical units (well, one is my wife's), but one of them is running iTIS TMC and the other TrafficMaster TMC - apart from this, I haven't noticed much difference in voice commands...however, I was more interested in comparing TMC and may have missed something.
Gareth, you have a PM about a radio station on your doorstep _________________ Andy
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