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Joined: Jan 06, 2006 Posts: 360 Location: East Sussex
Posted: Sun Nov 26, 2006 2:07 am Post subject:
Hi all.
With regards to the direction problem. I have had this.
The quickest way I've found for correcting a single camera is to delete the original one using 'edit cam' feature and use 'add cam' to put a camera in exactly the same place, then you will find the direction arrows will be in the correct orientation and you will be warned in the correct direction.
This is fine for a few edits (e.g. cameras in your local area) but I'd hate to have to edit the 10k+ cameras on the whole database like that.
The sooner we can start adding the direction info to the PGPSW database the better.
Ain't that right Sal.
Joined: Apr 04, 2006 Posts: 10118 Location: Bexhill, South Sussex, UK
Posted: Sun Nov 26, 2006 11:42 am Post subject:
Hi SallyAnn.
That was wonderful. Your patience has saved me loads of surfing, and has answered my questions. The km/hr MPH marking on the cams is pretty trivial, but as I said I was having the same probs with camera directions, which certainly caused the reason for my original post on the subject.
Incidentally, I don't seem to be able to find a definitive statement as to which way the arrow should point. I will experiment, but a quick post by someone who knows, will save me and probably others driving around like hooligans approaching speed cameras at various speeds and directions to find out.
Thanks again for the links Sal, they have given me a lot mote time to do what I suggested in my last paragraph.
Hi all.
With regards to the direction problem. I have had this.
The quickest way I've found for correcting a single camera is to delete the original one using 'edit cam' feature and use 'add cam' to put a camera in exactly the same place, then you will find the direction arrows will be in the correct orientation and you will be warned in the correct direction.
CeeJay.
Good point CJ - That's certainly the best way to get round the problem for the moment.
Joined: Jan 06, 2006 Posts: 360 Location: East Sussex
Posted: Mon Nov 27, 2006 12:57 am Post subject:
M8TJT wrote:
Incidentally, I don't seem to be able to find a definitive statement as to which way the arrow should point. I will experiment, but a quick post by someone who knows, will save me and probably others driving around like hooligans approaching speed cameras at various speeds and directions to find out.
Regards Trevor
A definitive statement. :D
The arrow you should select is the Up arrow as your direction of travel.
Needless to say if you find a camera on the opposite side of the road use the down arrow.
The latest version of the program is now available here:
http://www.box.net/public/2feqnsqios
Operating instructions are as before, except that now if you have camera direction information it will be used to create an appropriate direction symbol in your Mio, with the audio warnings adjusted so that you are not alerted when on the opposite carriageway to a camera.
The direction data has to be added to end of the line in the pocketgps_uk_sc.asc file for each camera, in the form: ,C,D
where C is the compass bearing in degrees of travel past the camera, and D is 1 for one-way or 2 for two-way.
As an example, there is a camera on the westbound carriageway of the A2 leading into London which has an entry in the file of:
0.07***,51.45***,"GATSO:468@50"
To change the Mio's indication of this camera from omni-directional to one-way, we add the direction data to make this record:
0.07***,51.45***,"GATSO:468@50",250,1
You don't have to add anything to the file for cameras where you don't have direction information. The program will just leave those as multi-directional (the 4-way arrow on the display)
Where does the direction data come from?
Well there are two answers to this. You can add it yourself for cameras that you know of; or perhaps those nice people at PGPSW can be persuaded to include the data for the growing number of cameras where they have recorded it. We can then report in the usual way when we find directional cameras that are not yet properly shown.
Sal
P.S. This is the only change from the previous version of MTC Builder, so if you aren't interested in playing with the direction data you don't need to download it. Also it still only works for the UK. But I'm working in that...
Sally or anyone else,
How do you work out the bearing degrees?
In your example your used 250 degrees, would it still work properly if I used 270 degrees?
Have we also got some directional data in the PGPSW database?
How do you work out the bearing degrees?
In your example your used 250 degrees, would it still work properly if I used 270 degrees?
Have we also got some directional data in the PGPSW database?
Dee
I don't know what other people do, but I centre the camera on the map with the 'North upwards' setting and lay a clear plastic protractor on the screen.
The directional data is being collected and the database guys have indicated that they will do something about including it, but clearly it's going to take a little time. In the meantime I'm sure they will be glad of any direction info we can submit - see the other post.
Joined: Apr 04, 2006 Posts: 10118 Location: Bexhill, South Sussex, UK
Posted: Wed Nov 29, 2006 7:52 pm Post subject:
CeeJay.
Thanks for that.
DeeJay01
I have a redlight camera close to me at the end of a short 150yd straighafter a 30/40deg r/h bend at 50.456N 0.46843E.
my Mio only alarms as I get onto the straight. The speed camera a bit earlier on the road at 50.84665N 0.47478E alarms at least 250yds from it, so I suppose from this that the 'acceptance' angle of the software is somewhat less than Plus/Minus 30Degrees.
Sal.
Thanks for all your previous inputs to the various forums, I have found them most interesting and informative.
I have a redlight camera close to me at the end of a short 150yd straighafter a 30/40deg r/h bend at 50.456N 0.46843E.
my Mio only alarms as I get onto the straight. The speed camera a bit earlier on the road at 50.84665N 0.47478E alarms at least 250yds from it, so I suppose from this that the 'acceptance' angle of the software is somewhat less than Plus/Minus 30Degrees.
Trevor, are those cameras both set to 'omni' on your unit, or directional?
Joined: Apr 04, 2006 Posts: 10118 Location: Bexhill, South Sussex, UK
Posted: Thu Nov 30, 2006 2:00 pm Post subject:
Sal.
They are both set to directional in MioMap which is also set to 'approaching' The direction of travel to be trapped by both these cameras is on the westbound carriageway (away from Hastings).
I set them by using CeeJay's idea of deleting then re-entering. The direction arrows in MioMap were then in the correct direction with regards to road orientation.
MioMap camera alert now works as expected, (just like you said it would)only alarming when travelling Westbound and totally ignoring them Eastbound. :D
I have used your program to convert the PGPS camera database, as the most easterly of the two cameras was not in Mio's original database. I have not used the Mio update program to see if it's there either.
Hope this helps.
That's extremely helpful Trevor, thank you.
Your mention of acceptance angles was very relevant and timely. If the device has too narrow an acceptance angle then in theory a camera could be hidden "around a corner" because the car is not heading directly towards it until the last minute. You seem to have found a case where the camera is not exactly hidden, but has apparently been given less warning.
The unit may well respond differently with an omni or direction setting, and it's something we Mio users will have to check out when the directional data becomes available, as we will be the first with GPS units that can take advantage of it.
I'm not sure that it will be a huge problem because from the official guidelines I have read, cameras should generally be mounted on straight roads. (No doubt someone will pop up with exceptions to this, in which case I hope they will carry out a test)
At least you are proving the point that unwanted alarms from the opposite carriageway can be eliminated, which is what this is all about.
Joined: Apr 04, 2006 Posts: 10118 Location: Bexhill, South Sussex, UK
Posted: Thu Nov 30, 2006 4:31 pm Post subject:
Sal
I'll have another go with the direction set to omni and 'Approaching'.
The problem here is that the second redlight camera is, I think, about the full alarm distance from the first speed trap, and I'm not certain that I determine whether it is the first or second camera that's alarming. I've just had a thought that If I look at the camera indicator on the screen it will tell me if it's the redlight or the speed that's causing the alarm. I'll check it out tomorrow on the way to work and report back.
Joined: Apr 04, 2006 Posts: 10118 Location: Bexhill, South Sussex, UK
Posted: Thu Nov 30, 2006 4:38 pm Post subject:
Sal
I'll have a go at approaching the redlight from the crossing roads at the weekend to see if I can get a better idea of the acceptance angle when set to 'approaching'.
Just thought. If I temporarily delete the first speed camera, I can then get a better idea of what's what without that one affecting the results from the redlight.
Sal
I'll have a go at approaching the redlight from the crossing roads at the weekend to see if I can get a better idea of the acceptance angle when set to 'approaching'.
Just thought. If I temporarily delete the first speed camera, I can then get a better idea of what's what without that one affecting the results from the redlight.
Trevor
Joined: Apr 04, 2006 Posts: 10118 Location: Bexhill, South Sussex, UK
Posted: Thu Nov 30, 2006 9:31 pm Post subject:
Sal.
I couldn't wait 'till the weekend, and as it's a couple of miles to the cameras from my house, I came up with a brilliant idea and 'set' a camera at the bottom of my road at the junction of De La Warr road. (Search for address 1 Glassenbury Drive, Bexhill on Sea, East Sussex (Not my address)). I set it to be 'all round' and my Mio to Simple audible warnings and 'Visible warnings' detailed'.
When approaching from either direction on the main road, it alarmed at about 300 yds as expected. (The first reading I saw on the camera warning was 290yd, so I suppose it's set to alarm at 300.
I then approached it south-east bound down Glassenbury Drive (three times) and it did NOT alarm until I turned the right hand bend and straightened out at 60yds from the 'camera'. So even with 'all round' and Simple warnings, it seems to have an acceptance angle of less than about +-45Deg as the bend is about that. I think that if it was a straight forward alarm at 300yd, it should have alarmed towards the top of the straight before the final bend.
So setting the direction of the camera, and setting 'Approaching' on the audible warnings definitely cuts out false alarms from cameras 'on the other carriageway' and there seems to be a built in angle of acceptance of something less than 45Deg, so it appears that cameras CAN 'hide round the corner'.
Now I know what range the cameras alarm at when driving straight at them, I'll try the redlight on the way to work tomorrow, as that bend is, I reckon, about 30 Deg. I'll post the further results here later in the morning.
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