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Joined: 11/07/2002 14:36:40 Posts: 23848 Location: Hampshire, UK
Posted: Mon Aug 29, 2005 9:44 am Post subject: Re: Caravan Club
Alan Sanders wrote:
Darren, alix776
Please see my posting Friday 26th August 4:43
Link- that should help to explain why the Caravan Club got a mention.
Alan
Ah right, I don't think a magazine can be held to blame for the content of an advert like that.
We will however continue to request an explanation from Evesham as to how our data came to be in a database that they are selling commercially without any reference to us and the work everyone here puts in to compile it
eBay is one thing, a company such as Evesham is another _________________ Darren Griffin
Posted: Mon Aug 29, 2005 11:13 am Post subject: My 2 peneth
Ok Ok some may say he who is without sin etc, there are several in these forums who dont have lets say totaly kosher stuff on their machines ok fine but what i find dispicable is when someone makes something that help others for free and then others try to sell it. Is it any wonder people see no hardship in using cracked versions of software when major companies openly rip off freeware providers. I'll tell you what lets do a deal every time elula etc ignore freeware being sold for a profit then we all have the right to have a pirated version of some commercial software seems fair to me. Oh! and whilst I'm on my high horse PC World stop ripping people off and charging £80 for linux
<---------If it isnt open source then its a rip off------------------>
Joined: 11/07/2002 14:36:40 Posts: 23848 Location: Hampshire, UK
Posted: Mon Aug 29, 2005 1:15 pm Post subject:
So long as it's not our data then I have no problem with it. If anything it helps us as their subscription cost is high so people invariably hear of ours. _________________ Darren Griffin
Having read the many views on this thread, I am concerned as to where action may lead.
While I totally disagree with anyone making money out of something which somone else has taken considerable time and effort to provide for free, can a site which tries to provide this information without insisting on payment, afford to spend too much time end effort (and presumably cost) preventing this unwelcome situation.
Yes, I believe that people are, if they so wish, entiltled to charge for their services, or even their instructions. If people are unhappy about this, my answer would be for them to write better instructions and 'donate' them to this site. Or if anyone is particularly good at instruction writing, to volunteer their services.
I for one, spent considerable time 'updating' the camera database instructions for CoPilot, so that a friend would not keep getting me to do the intall for him. I suppose that I could have tried to profit from this, but I just sent them into this site for them to do with as they wished. As it turned out, there is now a very much quicker way of applying the updates in CoPilot, which (so far as updating speed cameras is concerned) makes my work of limited use. Although as instructions for maintaining POIs in general, it would not take a great deal of work to knock them into shape should this be required. But please don't ask me directly; while I am prepared to do the work, cosiderable portions of it were based on work posted on this site, so I would only provide any of my work directly to this site at their request - and it would be at their sole discression if anything were to be done with it.
I fear that if a charge were made, people who have worked on this project, and willingly provided information free of charge, may be inclined to provide this information to another site, which would I think, most certainly emerge, prepared to provide this information freely.
Additionally, if a charge (no matter how nominal) were to be made, people would expect and require a much more professional product. As an example I state:
On certain stretches of road where there are mobile speed cameras, there are locations very near to each other. Whether this is due to differrent places where the cameras are located, or simply due to differrent co-ordinates being given for the same location - I do not know. The thought of someone, stopping, and actually going up to the officer to take a GPS co-ordinate fix amuses me! This has the effect in certain locations of giving a continuous stream of warnings, which can actually interfere with the navigation side.
Two locations causing problems are the M25 around Heathrow, and more recently the M42 around Birmingham Airport, with their numerous gantry cameras. Perhaps a differrent method of reporting these is required, with a separate section for these Variable speed Gantry cameras. I would suggest a single warning at the start, along the lines of 'Variable speed gantry cameras for x miles', with repeats after each junction to warn anyone joining, for those already on the motorway the warning would just give an indication of how much further they are to go on for. A warning for the end of the gantry cameras might be a bit more difficult; since the distance to warn is variable; a place, say 0.5 miles after the location of the last camera may be suitable for an 'End of Gantry cameras' message to be given.
In the end, if a charge is to be made for the sole intention of preventing others making a profit - it strikes me as 'cutting of your nose to spite your face' as I fear that it could potentially have a detrimental effect on the membership, and ultimately the sites viability.
Joined: May 02, 2005 Posts: 8 Location: Hampshire, UK
Posted: Mon Aug 29, 2005 4:44 pm Post subject:
Heydude wrote:
Dont know if you have this one you can even see the pocketgpsworld.com over the pictures! 8O
5800604590
looks like whoever is making a tidy profit!
regards
Heydude!! 8)
Well me blind, is this for real (the ebay advert)? This seller is selling the firmware UPDATE that any TomTom owner should know to get from TomTom's website for free.
I suppose the saying is true about one being born every minute...
On another note. Regarding all ebay sellers reported on this post; do you actually look at what it is that they are selling and what's an added bonus on their posting, or is it just blanket cover for all. What I mean is, do you report all sellers as bad people if there is any slight mention of "Speed Camera Database", or only when they try to sell off the database by itself?
What about people that sell their old TomTom Go or whatever GPS product, and in their salesman pitch add all the added extras and features, but that also includes this database, and they give credit where credit's due?
Example: So if I flog my TomTom on ebay and I list all the features and I mention that it includes a speed camera database freely obtainable from PocketGPSWorld.com am I now also a bad person, or am I still cool?
Joined: May 02, 2005 Posts: 8 Location: Hampshire, UK
Posted: Mon Aug 29, 2005 4:51 pm Post subject:
Seeing as I cannot edit my posting: I forgot to ask, is there any clear guidlines on how this database can be FREELY distributed, or not at all. Just asking as I have on a few occasions given this database to a few work colleagues on a usb key to add to their tomtoms, told them how great it is yada-yada-yada and where they can get the updates from. (at this site) did i break any laws, or did i do some free advertising for you?
Joined: 20/08/2002 11:51:57 Posts: 3859 Location: Essex, UK
Posted: Mon Aug 29, 2005 5:18 pm Post subject:
UncleBob wrote:
Heydude wrote:
Dont know if you have this one you can even see the pocketgpsworld.com over the pictures! 8O
5800604590
looks like whoever is making a tidy profit!
regards
Heydude!! 8)
Well me blind, is this for real (the ebay advert)? This seller is selling the firmware UPDATE that any TomTom owner should know to get from TomTom's website for free.
I suppose the saying is true about one being born every minute...
Well this guy is really taking the mick. Interestingly he is knowingly posting these images with our site name on them. Even more amazing is the Positive Feedback he gets... So you are right there is one born every minute.
UncleBob wrote:
On another note. Regarding all ebay sellers reported on this post; do you actually look at what it is that they are selling and what's an added bonus on their posting, or is it just blanket cover for all. What I mean is, do you report all sellers as bad people if there is any slight mention of "Speed Camera Database", or only when they try to sell off the database by itself?
We try to be fair about this and dont go after the people offering "Instructions". However a lot of these listings are badly worded and if we are unable to determine if they are selling the database or instructions then they will get reported.
UncleBob wrote:
What about people that sell their old TomTom Go or whatever GPS product, and in their salesman pitch add all the added extras and features, but that also includes this database, and they give credit where credit's due?
Example: So if I flog my TomTom on ebay and I list all the features and I mention that it includes a speed camera database freely obtainable from PocketGPSWorld.com am I now also a bad person, or am I still cool?
You are still cool. The people selling the database tend to sell it for less then £30. It is obvious to our Intellectual Property Officer where second hand hardware is being sold. A good example of this is 5802511339. We do not have any issue with this.
We do of course keep an eye out for dealers (selling more than one unit) of new goods. Most of these guys seem to have stopped advertising our database now. _________________ Mike Barrett
Now, I agree that those people selling the Database are scum, as are those who are selling ANY cracked / warez software - you name it it's on ebay.... BUT if you are going to stop people trading a free data base, that is the copyright of this site, maybe you should crack down on those offering other peoples copyrighted items within THIS site??
I tend to only read the TomTom Navigator sub forum, but there are daily requests and offers to swap voice files (John Cleese - Copyright TomTom 2005 perhaps?) that are clearly hacked / warez versions as TomTom locked them to the purchased system. This is just one example, it probably wouldn't take to long to find a few more examples...........
People in glass houses and all that...........
We always act when we see offers or requests for pirated software or discussions of such. I'll investigate as I hadn't spotted the Voices threads, if you have links I'll stop it.
Slightly off thread but there is a member on these forums (I'm afraid I cant remeber who) who has a link on their signature for an online book called UK Driving Secrets which claims to know all the loopholes etc on the UK road laws (speeding, parking etc). On closer inspection, and a quick search on Yahoo - it turns out this book is a right old load of b****x. If anyone sees this book for sale or sees the link on this site, AVOID IT. Do a search on Yahoo and you'll see results on the first page telling you why. Again, there is FREE, GENUINE information available if you look for it.
Darren, maybe you've already spotted this signature and taken off the link - if not can you search for it and have a look?
Joined: 11/07/2002 14:36:40 Posts: 23848 Location: Hampshire, UK
Posted: Tue Aug 30, 2005 2:22 pm Post subject:
I haven't seen it and unless it is blatant advertising we wouldn't intervene. But there are a number of such guides circulating, some better than others. As always with these things, they may identify a point of law or technicality which you could use to escape a conviction but is is by no means 100% effective and such information is available for free at sites such as the excellent Association of British Drivers website. _________________ Darren Griffin
I haven't seen it and unless it is blatant advertising we wouldn't intervene. But there are a number of such guides circulating, some better than others. As always with these things, they may identify a point of law or technicality which you could use to escape a conviction but is is by no means 100% effective and such information is available for free at sites such as the excellent Association of British Drivers website.
If you're able to search signatures Darren, I'd try and have a look. I'm fairly sure the link was followed by some promotional text which would contravene the Forum rules - whether the book is a load of old tosh or not!
Posted: Tue Aug 30, 2005 9:56 pm Post subject: Re: eBay and Other Sites Offering Our Safety Camera Database
I too have been caught by this scam, your software is currently being sold under the following reference Item number: 7995022412 the sooner scammers like this can be shut down the better
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me blind, is this for real (the ebay advert)? This seller is selling the firmware UPDATE that any TomTom owner should know to get from TomTom's website for free.
