HELP!! Southwark parking

[DennisN]

Yesterday I had a delivery to London SE1 1NL, Borough High Street, Southwark.

I saw it was a red route, so I drove up and down, looking for a parking exception bay. There were several and I eventually used one as close as I could see to my destination.

After doing the delivery, when I was tapping into the satnav to take me home, I looked up and was amazed to see a parking warden arrive and lean over my nearside bonnet. Thinking she was going to nick me, I waved my signed/timed delivery sheet at her, but she continued writing. So I got out and said "What are you doing?" she replied "You have committed an offence". I said "I've just done a delivery, here's the timed delivery signature, this is a loading bay". She said "You have commited an offence, go read the sign". So I went round the back of the sign and discovered it said 10am - 1pm (it was 2:30pm). Now I'm sure some other signs I saw were different times which would have allowed me to load at that time, so I am hoping to appeal when the ticket arrives, on the grounds that signs are not consistent in the area. I've looked on Streetview for signs, but there's so much traffic it's difficult to get a picture of sign times. I have seen and can capture three different signs - parking 10am-7pm, loading 10am-1pm and loading 10am-4pm. (They need enough visible background to prove it's Borough High Street).

That's only three that I can capture, which is not really enough to make a solid case to appeal. So is it possible there is anyone out there who is close enough to do me the favour of emailing me several photos showing variety of timings please? It's 120 miles away from me here, so I can't do it myself.

I'm getting paid £72.10 for the job, including £10 for the congestion charge, so a £60 fine will mean I get £2.10 to pay my costs for driving some 250 miles! (I get 27p a mile, so it was very galling to read the other day of a set of council workers striking over a proposal to reduce THEIR mileage allowance from 50p a mile!). Edit - I've just seen on their website that Southwark PCN will be £65, so I get paid £72.10 for my fine of £65 and congestion charge of £10, total £75. I have been able to capture pictures from Streetview showing 8 bays, timed 4 at 10am-4pm, 2 at 10am-1pm, 1 at 1pm-4pm and parking 10am-7pm - all of them on Borough High Street.

This is another example of the faceless state of the nation - in reasonable times, a traffic warden would come along and say "Begone, or I'll do you!" Nowadays, it's dish out a ticket to top up the council's budget. Traffic wardens are no longer here to assist with traffic flow, only to bring in cash.
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Dennis

If it tastes good - it's fattening.

Two of them are obesiting!!

[GPS_fan]

Traffic wardens are paid commission, so they have no incentive to do anything other than book you.

I believe they also have targets for number of bookings per day....that's progress for you
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Andy
PocketGPSWorld.com supports Help for Heroes - Read here

[M8TJT]

[Darren]

[DennisN]

[Darren]

Certainly privatised, council run wardens have only civil enforcement powers and parking on double yellows is a criminal offence.

But it's not as black and white as that as some areas are decriminalising some offences so that they can be enforced by these privatised warden operations.

I get increasingly angry at this, especially the ease with which DVLA will dish out owner details to any tom dick and harry who runs a car park.

Can I suggest you seek advice over at http://www.pepipoo.com/ ? They have some real experts in traffic law and a whole section on parking.

In the meantime I shall put a call out in tomorrow's Newsletter to see if we can get those photos for you.
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Darren Griffin

[MaFt]

[DennisN]

Thanks a lot Darren. I don't need pepipoo advice - I was bang to rights, definitely stopped in a bay at the wrong time.

I can only appeal on the grounds that they have inconsistent loading bay times and sufficient confusion in the driver to make a mistake (after all, I'm driving, watching traffic, watching pedestrians, buses and looking for the address I'm delivering to - so many shops and offices don't have their building number on display and looking for a permitted loading bay). I've just spent an age getting a dozen or so dubious visual quality screenshots from Streetview and have examples of times 1pm-4pm, 10am-4pm, 10am-7pm, and one of 10am-1pm (presumably the one that got me!). But if the Newsletter can get decent pictures for me I'll be very, very grateful.

And Twitter too! Thank you so much MaFt.

Obviously, I know the right people (even if I have no idea how twits work - because they don't work on my TomToms).
_________________
Dennis

If it tastes good - it's fattening.

Two of them are obesiting!!

[Daggers]

[Lacy]

Best of luck but I don't fancy your chances. It's your responsibility to check that you can use the bay you want to use. Quite a few places will have different loading times according to where they are; even in the same street so I can't see you being successful but nothing ventured etc.

Must say, I'm somewhat dismayed by the attitude of some posters on here trying to give 'advice' on how to park inconsideratly. I would have expected a more mature approach. There are good reasons why you shouldn't park on zig zags and double yellows so I wouldn't advise anyone does so simply to try and bend the rules for their own convenience.

[bernard47]

Hi Dennis, can you be more specific where you where actually parked, what side of the road and nearest side road? Islington also use the same tactics, in Upper Street Red Route there is a different time on each side of the road, and it is the same in Soho on the yellow lines different times on each side of the road. And be careful everyone about parking on double yellow lines and zig zags which also carry 3 points, although there may be no police about, the CTV Cameras can still issue tickets for these offences, make sure there are no cameras pointing at the location. Although you are correct in saying they inconsistant, I think in an appeal I would use the term Deliberate Entrapment, which surely must be illegal for any council to use these tactics to ensnare motorist.

[gomatics]

I would use the argument, either in a letter to the council or in court, that as every bay within reasonable distance to your delivery shop / office was taken you had no choice.

PS, I met you guys in Cebit a few years ago talking about Haicom trackers.
We went with Jimmy from Evermore for a snack at the upstairs cafe in IKEA
arwel @ ehorsepower.co.uk

[TieJustice]

Good luck with that, in my past experience (I no longer go in to town I will order online first) I parked on yellow lines as the wife is disabled and had to go to a DHSS Dr for assessment to see if here amputaeted leg would grow back??? Even with the badge on full desply both parts we got a 70.00 and 50.00 as I told the TW is a retard or what, and thats insulting a TW.

Any way it turned out there where faded yellow strips, you would not notice them unless you looked for them and knew where.

Any way it's a good way the stop every one form going in to town but it's hard for any delivery driver (been there).

[jdalexander2001]

You need some sort of device that you could load some POI to that could tell you where to park and limitations - .



I once payed for a parking ticket at the machine, displayed it in my car and went to the hospital. Came back and found a parking ticket on my car and then noticed that half the road was for pay and display and the other half was residents only. I tried to appeal as i brought the ticket in good faith but they rejected my claim and i had to pay.

[aerotec]

If she walked up while you were in the van why did you not just drive off? My understanding is that they need to have photographic evidence of the ticket on the vehicle before it is deemed "served".

I am in Balham so could maybe get some pics for you if you can confirm exact locations you want the pics of.

I got a ticket a few days ago as I was parked in front of a dropped kerb. Didn't realise that was an offence. Annoying thing is you can see there used to be double yellow lines that have been burnt away. If you can't park there why did they burn the double yellows away? Can only be so those not aware you can't park against a dropped kerb will do so and can then be ticketed. Just so very sneaky!

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