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Directional Warnings for All (Well, Nearly...!)
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M8TJT
The Other Tired Old Man
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Joined: Apr 04, 2006
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PostPosted: Sat Sep 26, 2009 5:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

PaulB, thanks for the pointer. BigPerk, you are of course correct and the NOT was NOT insignificant at all Very Happy . Now corrected in my original post. Embarassed My appologies for any alarm and despondency caused Embarassed and thanks to you both for pointing it out so succinctly.
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MikeB
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PostPosted: Sat Sep 26, 2009 6:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

As I said in my earlier post:
MikeB wrote:

Nothing will change from the the user's point of view other than the name of the camera.


Of course we have no intention of degrading our data, what we are trying to do is improve the user experience where manufacturers do not cater for directional information.

For systems that are capable of using directional data then they will still get the best data we have available.
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BigPerk
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PostPosted: Sat Sep 26, 2009 6:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I don't usually have the bearing shown on my satnav, but this should certainly make it worth setting on Laughing . The bearing is to the camera is it, so that when my device shows I am heading North, the camera name will also show 'N' if it's checking me?
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David
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MaFt
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PostPosted: Sun Sep 27, 2009 12:08 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

bigperk: if a camera is, for example, NW-GATSO:12345@30 then it means it will 'capture' you if you are travelling North West

sallyann: just to confirm, these are an 'add on' to the camera names for those devices / downloads that cannot handle proper heading data. those that can use the real data have been unchanged. we felt that simplifying it to W instead of, for example, 278, 264 or 271 would be far easier to mentally digest while driving.

MaFt
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aj2052
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PostPosted: Mon Sep 28, 2009 1:09 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I wouldnt think that the majority of users woulld know or even be interested in whether they are going north,north west,south or werever, they are probably more than likely looking at the road directions ahead and not having a north only facing map.
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MaFt
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PostPosted: Mon Sep 28, 2009 6:30 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

aj2052 wrote:
I wouldnt think that the majority of users woulld know or even be interested in whether they are going north,north west,south or werever, they are probably more than likely looking at the road directions ahead and not having a north only facing map.


really? i generally know what direction i'm driving in... perhaps that's just me though.

it also serves to help keep the database up to date - if a user wanted to check which of their local cameras have heading data then it is easy to see from a quick POI search which need it adding and submit via the site.

MaFt
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Andy_P
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PostPosted: Mon Sep 28, 2009 10:43 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi MaFt and team....

I'm sure you must have discussed this at length already before you implemented the new scheme, but instead of the new format: "W-MOBILE:53183@30" I would have preferred to have the bearing at the END of the name, as in: "MOBILE-W:53183@30".

To my mind it would be less confusing, especially when it's combined with other prefixes like the "PMobiles" and the "TSPECS"

Also, it might mean SallyAnn's program for the Mio would still work?
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BigPerk
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PostPosted: Mon Sep 28, 2009 11:13 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Sorry Andy_P, I disagree with that, quite strongly. The most important thing to know quickly IMHO is whether the camera is relevant. Therefore the direction needs to be the first thing you see, easily - that means, to me, at the beginning of the title.
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Pocketgps
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PostPosted: Mon Sep 28, 2009 11:46 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

aj2052 wrote:
I wouldnt think that the majority of users woulld know or even be interested in whether they are going north,north west,south or werever, they are probably more than likely looking at the road directions ahead and not having a north only facing map.


I totally agree with you.

Personally I think this could cause a problem. People seeing this info and just thinking is that correct, or am I driving in that direction etc, mind not on their driving, only takes a second for it all to go wrong.

This could be a distraction too far. Just my personal feelings.
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BigPerk
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PostPosted: Mon Sep 28, 2009 12:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Pocketgps says
Quote:
Personally I think this could cause a problem. People seeing this info and just thinking is that correct, or am I driving in that direction etc, mind not on their driving, only takes a second for it all to go wrong.

This could be a distraction too far.


Not sure that it need be any more of a distraction than 'GATSO', etc - ignore if not interested. The most distracting thing is the camera itself, which is one reason I don't like them too much.

However the comment has given me more thought. It is only any use on an ordinary (ie non-motorway) road, if the satnav displays a compass direction for comparison. But then how is PGPSW going to insert the correct direction, given the roads change direction all the time? But if it's NOT the actual road direction, then it's probably NOT helpful and NOT a good idea.

On some motorways it's perhaps simpler, and you don't really need a compass - cameras on the North-bound carriageway of the M1 will presumably all be marked 'N', so any 'S' camera is bound to be a false alarm. But if the motorway changes its accepted description, such as 'M25E' to 'M25N', then the same difficulty arises, I think.
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aj2052
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PostPosted: Mon Sep 28, 2009 5:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The first thing that springs to mind is K.I.S.S., I think for most drivers the warnings are a background sound, adding more info brings them to the foreground by making you think more about the message, drivers should be aware of every warning whichever side because someday one on the other side will probably catch you anyway.
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MikeB
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PostPosted: Mon Sep 28, 2009 5:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

aj2052 wrote:
... drivers should be aware of every warning whichever side because someday one on the other side will probably catch you anyway.

Interestingly I have always found it interesting that people complain about False alerts on the other side of the road. To my mind if speed cameras and red light cameras are placed properly then which ever direction the camera is covering you you are being warned that this is a dangerous area that you are entering.

Obviously there are exceptions to this such as dual carriageways but in general an accident on the other side of a dual carriageway will cause rubbernecking and panic breaking on your side, so the warning is still valid...

Just my 2Ps worth.
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Sallyann
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PostPosted: Mon Sep 28, 2009 6:47 pm    Post subject: Re: Directional Warnings for All (Well, Nearly...!) Reply with quote

M8TJT wrote:
Hi Sal, long time no hear.

No. You can blame lots of work Crying or Very sad and great flying weather Very Happy

M8TJT wrote:
I'm certain that MaFt is (edit to include NOT) NOT suggesting that he ditches the accurate directional data that I am still involved with, but just to give an indication on non-directional devices of the direction of the cam . I have done a bit more research into the IGO speed cam stuff and found that the acceptance angle can be adjusted, by altering a setting in the sys.txt file. I am currently running mine at 45 Deg, but believe that the default is somewhere around the 25 degs that my original investigations indicated. There is also a setting by which you can set the distance off the road, so I have set mine to about 30 meters (Yes, OK, I've done it in meters, but that does not mean that I am fully metricized yet) and have tested it against cams on nearby roads and this seems to work a treat. You only get alerts from cams on the right heading AND on the road that you are on even with no route set. It's absolutely super, and possibly the best solution of all. Shame about the SPECS implementation not being very good, but I have also programmed my way around this as well.

That's very interesting. iGO is certainly clever. I think you should document the work you have done on tailoring it as there must be others who would find your results useful.

Quote:
Does your prog work for p-mobiles etc.? I havnt checked.

I don't include p-mobiles myself, because I suspect there may be many doubtful reports. I prefer to wait until they have been confirmed. I haven't checked the Builder code (which probably predates the p-mobile file) but I think you might need to rename p-mobiles as mobiles to be accepted by it.
(As an aside, I also filter out the 70mph mobiles to avoid the all those beeps at motorway bridges).

Thanks to everyone for correcting my hasty conclusions about the change. I will do a check with the new file format to confirm that the Builder is not affected.
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MaFt
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PostPosted: Tue Sep 29, 2009 1:43 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

if memory serves me correctly the builder only works for uk coordinates anyway?

in which case nothing has changed - the N NE E... are only added to the downloads that do not have real heading data. the mio mtc download, which contains the asc files with heading as well at the pre-built MTC, has been unnafected.

MaFt
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Sallyann
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PostPosted: Wed Sep 30, 2009 2:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

@MaFt,
The Builder works with coordinates from 36N to 70N, and 12W to 69E.
I confirm that it's unaffected by your changes.

Sal
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