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Transport for London Digital Speed Map - TomTom & Garmin

 
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Darren
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PostPosted: Fri Mar 27, 2009 6:04 pm    Post subject: Transport for London Digital Speed Map - TomTom & Garmin Reply with quote

pocketgpsworld.comTransport for London (TfL) have launched a digital speed map.

Available for download on TfL's website, the POI based map is available in Garmin & TomTom formats as well as KML and consists of a set of POIs covering the various enforced speed limits.

The files are an off-shoot from TfL's Intelligent Speed Adaptation (ISA) project exploring new technology in the fields of speed management. Any technology requires an accurate digital speed 'map' and hence the data has been captured for these purposes. The digital data will be made available to to anyone who wishes to create an application or indeed as here for personal use.

TfL claim, "The map has been collected from a 'drivers point of view' and records the physical location of speed limit signs on the road network. Both terminal and repeater signs have been collected, with attributes used for distinguishing sign direction for double-sided signs. Collection involves recording only the actual sign records, which are later used to derive the speed limit for road lengths in a vector digital map."

We haven't yet had an opportunity to test the POIs but if you want to have a go, they can be downloaded from TfL's website here.
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Darren
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PostPosted: Fri Mar 27, 2009 6:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Not a terribly encouraging start. Installed on a 720 and whilst the menu's appear, I cannot access the configuration screen. Pressing the Config Menu Button does nothing whatsoever!

The Start/Stop buttons trigger a Start/Stop message though.

Anyone else brave enough to test?
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G1LIW
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PostPosted: Fri Mar 27, 2009 7:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I heard about this a month or so ago, downloaded the POI file, and whaddya know, it doesn't work, my copy of TTNv6 couldn't even see the darn OV2s.

Tried it again today, wondering if they'd somehow fixed the problem... nope. Still cannot see the poi files in TomTom.

Hardly a surprise from a government-supported project, funded by public money.
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Darren
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 28, 2009 10:00 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The POIs work fine albeit they are of limited value as they are. They should work fine on your device too?
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PaulB2005
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 28, 2009 10:06 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'll try these POIs later but on an SD Card. With Garmin you replicate the folder structure on the SD Card i.e. make the folder "POI" under the folder "Garmin" in the root of the card and put the GPI file into the POI folder...

Is this true for TT as well? I assume these go in the map folder like other POIs?
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Darren
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 28, 2009 10:20 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

PaulB2005 wrote:
I'll try these POIs later but on an SD Card. With Garmin you replicate the folder structure on the SD Card i.e. make the folder "POI" under the folder "Garmin" in the root of the card and put the GPI file into the POI folder...

Is this true for TT as well? I assume these go in the map folder like other POIs?

Correct, they just go in the map folder as with all other POIs. I'm wondering if G1L1W's issue is related to POI limits?
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G1LIW
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 28, 2009 11:23 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Don't think so, but I'll check, and get back to you here. Too tired now, just got home from a long night shift Sad
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PaulB2005
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 28, 2009 12:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Just loaded the POIs on a Garmin and now have lots of lovely grey dots everywhere - usually because there are over 256 categories but i only have 16 plus the PGPSW speed camera database. This POIs database only adds a handful more...

Looking at a demo route it seems like it would be a nightmare as the speed limits near me change from 20-30-20-30 more often than the weather changes. The screen would be littered with icons plus it creates loads of Alert:20 and Alert:30 alerts.....
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rayle
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 28, 2009 1:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

PaulB2005 wrote:
Just loaded the POIs on a Garmin and now have lots of lovely grey dots everywhere - usually because there are over 256 categories but i only have 16 plus the PGPSW speed camera database. This POIs database only adds a handful more...

Looking at a demo route it seems like it would be a nightmare as the speed limits near me change from 20-30-20-30 more often than the weather changes. The screen would be littered with icons plus it creates loads of Alert:20 and Alert:30 alerts.....


Rather than try the POI on my Satnav, I have converted them to CSV and had a look at them using AutoRoute,

Voice reminders of speed limit would drive me bonkers as they would in some places be going all the time, you are right, a real nightmare.

There are about 100 unknown speed limits which seem to be in and around the 20mph Roads.

I can, if anyone would like them, upload as a CSV file, subject to the copyright on the website, which states "Along with the source code of our application, we are making available Point of Interest (POI) files to allow developers to create applications for other common satellite navigation systems."
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SpikeyMikey
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 28, 2009 1:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I've downloaded and configured the POI's for TTN6 and they show OK. I set warnings for 20 @200yds / 30 @300yds etc. This may not be the best setting.

As already mentioned I end up with a lot of alerts on certain routes, also the icons are a lower resolution version of the PGPSW ones for Gatsos, which is a bit confusing.

All in all I don't think I would use them due to the constant earache. Unless someone tells me they can be configured better.

G1LIW: Have you enabled the POI's and set the 'Warn when near' option?
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G1LIW
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 28, 2009 4:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

ok, few hours sleep has done wonders.

I've gone into my TTNv6 PDA and, after checking that they're not being used, purged all the POI files that aren't being used.

As you can see from the collected screen shots below, there are 106 POI categories in my copy of TTv6. Of these, 52 categories are active. I cannot figure out how, if it's even possible, to delete the "factory-fitted" POI categories, but even so, I decided to test a theory, and have found that it won't even pick up the "Public_Toilet_PGPSW.ov2" file either Evil or Very Mad

Anyone got any ideas on this one, cause I'm all out.

Here's the composite screen shot, shots in order from first menu top left, moving along left to right, row by row....


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Darren
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 28, 2009 4:54 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Almost certainly too many custom POIs installed. Each device has a limit, not sure what it is on your ONE (and factory installed POIs don't count towards this).

You can test by uninstalling all the added POIs except our speedcams or else you'll need to re-configure alerts later.

Then add the Public Toilets POI or one of the tfL ones and test.
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G1LIW
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 28, 2009 5:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I was afraid this might be the case. OK, thanks. I'll get back to you later on this.
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gazphone
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 30, 2009 10:00 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi, This works on my 720 with navcore 8.070 Truck. I did give it a short road test this morning (in my car, Laughing Out Loud) on the school run, I live outside the TFL area, the only thing that that flashed was 'NO SPEED LIMIT DATA AVAILABLE' when this flashed the tomtom human cutout. I am going to london this afternoon so will be able to give it a good road test.

As the logs are saved with information of your driving will this be exchanged to TFL with any updates?
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gazphone
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 31, 2009 9:59 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

gazphone wrote:
Hi, This works on my 720 with navcore 8.070 Truck. I did give it a short road test this morning (in my car, Laughing Out Loud) on the school run, I live outside the TFL area, the only thing that that flashed was 'NO SPEED LIMIT DATA AVAILABLE' when this flashed the tomtom human cutout. I am going to london this afternoon so will be able to give it a good road test.

As the logs are saved with information of your driving will this be exchanged to TFL with any updates?


With a bit of fine tuning i stopped the human from cutting out. I went along the M2/A2 after passing the M25 turn off, still on the A2 the TFL kicked in the speed for this part of the road is 70mph but the TFL said it was only 30 I remember that tomtom did report this stretch of road being only 30mph but mapshare sorted this out a long time ago. as I was going over TFL's speed limit the map cut out and told me to slow down, the map did not come back again till I slowed down to around 35mph. only where the limit changes to 50 did the TFL update the speed limit to 50mph, Passing the gatso @ 50mph, I turned off at the black prince turn off driving along Gravel Hill A220. The TFL reported the speed to be 50mph all the way to bronze age way A2016, I would like to point out the speed limit for A220 is 30 and has two gatso cameras. The TFL reported the speed limit to be 50 all the to and including Easten way, this road is 30mph and there is a mobile camera location for the 30mph road. just for my short trip to work if I did not have the PocketGPSworld camera database and did not see the cameras, the signs or read the road, I would of lost my driving licence passing 3 gatso's two of which I would of been doing 20mph over the speed limit and one mobile again 20mph over the speed limit.

It was the same story for my trip in to south east london where there were 20mph roads the TFL would not update the speed after passing the 30 sign for some miles. some roads where 30mph road but the TFL would report it to be 50mph other roads where 30mph but TFL reported it to be 20mph. I think TFL should get the speed of the roads from TomTom as the database they are using is out of date.

Daily Speed Log
Date: 2009-03-30
Miles: 131.49
Miles (info): 2.62
Miles (alert): 6.84

BTW I didn't go over the speed limit once.

I think I will be waiting for some time before I use it again.
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