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emjaiuk
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Location: North Surrey (TW17) UK
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 Posted: Fri Oct 31, 2008 10:56 am Post subject: |
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I'm afraid I must disagree with Darren's comments in the previous post. I totally accept that all product manufactures must innovate and continually release new products in order to survive, but there is a world of difference between introducing a new improved product with additional working features, and using the promise, and I use that word deliberately, of future additions in order to drive sales of a product. I think all the customers who decided to upgrade at a particular moment in time because they thought that the product that they were upgrading to was to have an additional feature added are entitled to feel very aggrieved if that additional feature was subsequently only available on yet another upgrade.
As has been said before, at the end of the day, a GPS unit is primarily to assist the user in getting from A-B, as no doubt many PDA and early PND users are still managing to do. The only reason to upgrade is for additional features. I myself moved from TT5 to a 910 purely to be able to use TMC traffic. I am very anti TomTom purely because I am still not able to do this.
I wonder if PGPSW will still be as defensive of TT when they introduce a version of Navcore which is only able to use POIs which have been downloaded via Home?
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Darren
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Joined: 11/07/2002 14:36:40
Posts: 23848
Location: Hampshire, UK
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| Posted: Fri Oct 31, 2008 11:12 am Post subject: |
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| emjaiuk wrote: | | I think all the customers who decided to upgrade at a particular moment in time because they thought that the product that they were upgrading to was to have an additional feature added are entitled to feel very aggrieved if that additional feature was subsequently only available on yet another upgrade. |
At no point have I said that you do not have a right to feel aggrieved. I broached this issue because I agreed that is was poor and ought to have been honestly communicated by TomTom. What I have said that talk of Trading Standards etc is premature until the full facts are known i.e. is it shelved or merely delayed. It's not the first time they have U-turned nor had to change planned launch dates after all!
| emjaiuk wrote: | | I wonder if PGPSW will still be as defensive of TT when they introduce a version of Navcore which is only able to use POIs which have been downloaded via Home? |
I wouldn't put such a move past TomTom and thankfully they are but one part of our operation and an ever smaller proportion thankfully. I'd be more concerned as a consumer if they chose to exclude community sites from the POI service. We've seen how well they manage verification of MapShare i.e. they don't so gawd help you if they become responsible for POIs as well AND you have only their speed camera database to choose from!
I'm simply trying to inject some perspective into this debate about new models and functionality constantly appearing. If you choose to upgrade based on some future functionality as yet unreleased then you have taken a gamble! I have created a HD Traffic thread and discussion surrounding that needs to be conducted there please.
As for TomTom, I'm more annoyed with them than ever. Far from being defensive of them we're incensed at them for permitting HOME to be used as a conduit for data belonging to us and other community web-sites. We have raised the matter with them and to be honest they clearly couldn't give a damn. We're not going to let that rest.
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Darren Griffin
Last edited by Darren on Fri Oct 31, 2008 11:26 am; edited 1 time in total |
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StuartStrangeboy
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Joined: Nov 09, 2005
Posts: 84
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| Posted: Fri Oct 31, 2008 8:40 pm Post subject: |
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| I think the timing of the live units and the current financial climate is crucial to TomTom, I know a lot of people are sceptical about the new units, myself included because next year more an more people are expected to pick up smart phones with sat nav on them, smart phones are a huge seller right now and with bigger screens and larger memory, this I feel may well be a big factor with the live series as more people turn to smart phones. |
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Darren
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Joined: 11/07/2002 14:36:40
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Location: Hampshire, UK
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| Posted: Sat Nov 01, 2008 9:26 am Post subject: |
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| StuartStrangeboy wrote: | | I think the timing of the live units and the current financial climate is crucial to TomTom, I know a lot of people are sceptical about the new units, myself included because next year more an more people are expected to pick up smart phones with sat nav on them, smart phones are a huge seller right now and with bigger screens and larger memory, this I feel may well be a big factor with the live series as more people turn to smart phones. |
Every analysis predicts steady growth in Smart phones but not at the expense of even faster growth in PND's.
The simple fact is a Smart Phone is not the ideal form factor for a sat-nav. The screens are too small and the interaction is difficult when in-use in a car.
Much of the growth will be as a direct result of more being equipped with GPS, my parents have a Nokia with GPS and wouldn't have a clue how to use it or be able to read it if they did 
They make ideal emergency or secondary devices but will not replace a primary PND much as a phone would never replace a dedicated .mp3 player for most of us or a camera.
And now I'm wandering way OT!
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MoonBeam
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Joined: Dec 30, 2006
Posts: 2
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| Posted: Sun Nov 02, 2008 12:42 am Post subject: |
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| roadangelboss wrote: | | Darren wrote: | | I would have one if I needed the HD Traffic. I don't drive much these days and the subscription would be another issue. The safety camera data, supposedly Gold Standard as it is sourced from Road Angel is surprisingly poor in my opinion. I have just returned from a 500 mile round trip to Wales and whilst we had the SPECS zone on the M40 at Warwick, TomTom did not. One of many that we have recorded but which were missing from the 940. |
Hi Darren, tried to catch up with you at the event today but you'd shot back to the office to write up this report, so I introduced myself to Mike instead. Much like HD traffic the Road Angel cameras on the X40 have been a bit hit and miss during the development/testing phase as we were refining the update processes - all should be well for the production products though.
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I'm thinking of buying the x40 but have a few questions:
1)How long is one able to use the RoadAngel updates, is it a 1 year subscription or continuing?
2)Can I opt out of Road Angel if needed and use PGPSW data? If so would I just delete the TomTom safety camera POIs and install yours as in previous models eg http://www.pocketgpsworld.com/uksafetycameras-tomtom-go.php
Link edited for clarity & corrections - Oldboy |
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mikealder
Pocket GPS Moderator
Joined: Jan 14, 2005
Posts: 19638
Location: Blackpool , Lancs
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| Posted: Sun Nov 02, 2008 9:38 am Post subject: |
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I have no idea about your first question, but the second is easy, you delete or disable the TomTom Safety Camera files and put the database from this site on the x40.
The set up is the same as with any other TomTom unit and you have the option to use ogg files or the Text To Speech to generate the warning sounds - Mike |
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Darren
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Joined: 11/07/2002 14:36:40
Posts: 23848
Location: Hampshire, UK
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| Posted: Sun Nov 02, 2008 9:43 am Post subject: |
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| MoonBeam wrote: | | 1)How long is one able to use the RoadAngel updates, is it a 1 year subscription or continuing? |
The actual data can only be updated if your subscription is active. Whether you can continue to use the installed data when a subscription expires remains to be seen but as with our database, out of date data is not recommended.
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MikeB
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Joined: 20/08/2002 11:51:57
Posts: 3859
Location: Essex, UK
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| Posted: Sun Nov 02, 2008 3:33 pm Post subject: |
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| Cfcfan wrote: | | Did you get any idea when the HD module will be available for x30s? I bought a 930 earlier this year specifically to get HD when it became available. Can you buy the module in the Nether lands and subscribe to the UK service? |
Unfortunately you have to buy the module in the country you are going to use it in. This is because it comes with a SIM card set up for the service. The SIM card is country specific.
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s3dbw
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Joined: May 07, 2004
Posts: 203
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| Posted: Sun Nov 02, 2008 5:45 pm Post subject: |
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| Quote: | | Unfortunately you have to buy the module in the country you are going to use it in. This is because it comes with a SIM card set up for the service. The SIM card is country specific. |
Does this mean that if I go to Europe with the unit then it wont pick up on local traffic info in whatever European country I happen to be traveling through?
Thanks |
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mikealder
Pocket GPS Moderator
Joined: Jan 14, 2005
Posts: 19638
Location: Blackpool , Lancs
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| Posted: Sun Nov 02, 2008 5:49 pm Post subject: |
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| Yes it does mean the data is specific to the country the device is purchased in, AFAIK the device cannot roam onto different networks while in different countries - if you want traffic information whilst overseas you would be best to get the RDS-TMC receiver and plug that in to the device while abroad - Mike |
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mcwarre
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Joined: Mar 25, 2004
Posts: 157
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| Posted: Sun Nov 02, 2008 7:01 pm Post subject: |
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| Darren wrote: | | MoonBeam wrote: | | 1)How long is one able to use the RoadAngel updates, is it a 1 year subscription or continuing? |
The actual data can only be updated if your subscription is active. Whether you can continue to use the installed data when a subscription expires remains to be seen |
You can use the item with an out of date database.
What surprises me is that every opportunity is taken to spread doubt about other speed camera databases. I have a PGPSW speed camera subscription and a road angel one. Without getting into the merits of one above the other or which is best I am disappointed that several mods seem to post in a rather blinkered fashion.
Not starting a troll war, just an observation.
And no, I am not connected to road angel in anyway (or any other GPS/IT one) |
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Darren
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Location: Hampshire, UK
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| Posted: Sun Nov 02, 2008 7:07 pm Post subject: |
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As no other provider entertains public discussion I don't see anything unfair. Where an issue exists I speak as I find as I am entitled to do
Where we have posted in defence or promotion of our database we have done so based on our experience of another product. As we run a database I think we have every right to promote it within these forums.
If TomTom, RoadAngel, Talex or anyone else wish to launch a forum and enter into open discussion on their collection methods, reporting process etc then all well and good and we would applaud that.
And as fort eh original question, how can you possibly know 'if' access will remain after a LIVE sub has expired? This is an entirely different service to that which has gone before. My response was correct based on my knowledge of the x40. As it has a subscription I do not know what services are blocked when that subscription expires
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mcwarre
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Joined: Mar 25, 2004
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| Posted: Sun Nov 02, 2008 7:17 pm Post subject: |
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Darren,
You seemed to have taken that as me having a pop. I didn't mean it to be so - apologies if it came across as one.
The original question on roadangel never mentioned LIVE it mentioned roadangel updates (or am I missing the point?). Has anyone actually confirmed that the cameras used by tomtom are roadangel? I have a subscription to tomtom traffic (ppc) and camera database (got it as an offer). The tomtom speed camera database is not the same as my roadangel one (explicitly the frequency of updates). Am I missing something??? |
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Darren
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Joined: 11/07/2002 14:36:40
Posts: 23848
Location: Hampshire, UK
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| Posted: Sun Nov 02, 2008 7:20 pm Post subject: |
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| mcwarre wrote: | Darren,
You seemed to have taken that as me having a pop. I didn't mean it to be so - apologies if it came across as one. |
Not at all, I'm simply answering what was clearly a criticism, you are entitled to your opinion.
| Quote: | | The original question on roadangel never mentioned LIVE it mentioned roadangel updates (or am I missing the point?). Has anyone actually confirmed that the cameras used by tomtom are roadangel? I have a subscription to tomtom traffic (ppc) and camera database (got it as an offer). The tomtom speed camera database is not the same as my roadangel one (explicitly the frequency of updates). Am I missing something??? |
You may be! In respect of the x40 range, the speed camera data supplied as part of the LIVE sub is uniquely supplied by RoadAngel for UK devices hence my earlier reply.
It's a clear indication that TomTom recognise their UK data is sub-standard as they have not chosen alternate providers for any other launch country.
I understand RA's data will only be sued on the x40's LIVE service.
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Darren Griffin |
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mcwarre
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Joined: Mar 25, 2004
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| Posted: Sun Nov 02, 2008 7:25 pm Post subject: |
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| Darren wrote: | | I understand RA's data will only be sued on the x40's LIVE service. |
Hehe,
An intentional Freudian slip...... ;) |
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