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How long before in-car PNDs are banned.

 
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Zebb
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Joined: Aug 28, 2008
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PostPosted: Mon Nov 03, 2008 8:40 pm    Post subject: How long before in-car PNDs are banned. Reply with quote

Now that extra features are embedded in PNDs, more time and attention is taken away from the actual driving. Googling for nearby 'Fancy dress shops', searching for cheaper fuel etc, even if you can do it by voice, look like a recipe for accidents.

Just like mobile phones, I expect restrictions to be brought in and maybe even banned altogether. Opinions?
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PaulB2005
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PostPosted: Mon Nov 03, 2008 10:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The use of Sat Navs are already covered under law. If you cause an accident (or appear to be driving dangerously) whilst operating a Sat Nav then the law is already in place to deal with you. Same as if you cause an accident or drive dangerously whilst lighting a cigarette, fiddle with the radio, adjust your seat, do your make up, shave, or operate a Mobile Phone.

if you are going to be

Quote:
Googling for nearby 'Fancy dress shops', searching for cheaper fuel etc


then you need to do it safely, as usual.
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M8TJT
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Location: Bexhill, South Sussex, UK

PostPosted: Tue Nov 04, 2008 10:18 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Am I mistaken, or did not this, let's have a few dozen new laws this week, crazy, busybody, data loosers of a government bring in a half baked law specifically banning hand held phones, with the rest tacked on?
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Zebb
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PostPosted: Tue Nov 04, 2008 11:48 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Watching the new x40 videos on this site, suggesting possible sales of up to 40 million PNDs and as a relative noob to sat nav, having a small screen in front of the driver as a great new toy, it's just a matter of time before some high profile accidents involving PNDs are the flavour of the month in the media.

Perhaps they'll be forced to program it to stop any changes to the PND once the vehicle is moving. Time will tell. Drive safely, yes good idea.
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PaulB2005
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PostPosted: Tue Nov 04, 2008 12:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
Perhaps they'll be forced to program it to stop any changes to the PND once the vehicle is moving.


Why? Radios and CD players don't have any such restrictions. Some drivers might get the passenger to operate the unit when moving. Garmin units have a lock on that prevents their use in motion however it's easily switched off but you have to click that you agree that you do so at your own risk.

Quote:
having a small screen in front of the driver


Yes some people put them in stupid places but some, like mine, are moved out of the way near the radio on a custom mount.

As stated before the law already covers those that drive / operate on board equipment in a dangerous manner.
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aj2052
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PostPosted: Wed Nov 05, 2008 2:13 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think Driving without due care and attention probably covers a multitude of sins at present already.
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Zebb
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PostPosted: Thu Nov 06, 2008 10:29 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Why?

Does your radio have a qwerty keyboard and menus within menus, mine doesn't.

I saw this picture on another forum;
http://www.gpspassion.com/forumsen/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=107979&whichpage=3
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PaulB2005
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PostPosted: Thu Nov 06, 2008 10:48 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

As has been mentioned several times above the law already caters for drivers who cause accidents and / or death whilst operating a Sat Nav. My point was that it doesn't matter WHAT you are doing, if it is deemed to be dangerous to do whilst driving then the law can deal with it. The number of buttons and menus is neither here nor there.

My point about the radio is you could be distracted long enough to cause an accident just changing radio station (one button press) but there are no speed interlocks for radios to disable their use when driving. Who determines how many button presses are safe or not?

Many thousands of drivers do many millions of miles a year with Sat Nav. If any of them cause an accident or a death by using it when driving then the law will deal with them. The number of accidents and deaths caused by drivers operating their Sat Nav is very small. On your basis you might as well ban stairs because the number of people that are injured and kiled each year falling down them is that much greater than those injured and killed by drivers operating Sat Nav.
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Zebb
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PostPosted: Thu Nov 06, 2008 11:04 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Well I still think that it's only a matter of time and some high profile media cases, that PNDs will be especially targeted just as the mobile phones have been. Laws existed for driving before the special ones that refer to mobile phones use in cars. The expected million of new sales of PNDs will increase the chances of this happening.

IMO, dangerous driving is rarely prosecuted and is usually reduced to careless driving. It seemed to me as a relative new user to PNDs that my attention is constantly drawn to the PND much more so than radios etc, and I have used PMRs (personal mobile radios) and mobile phones for decades.

We'll see.
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SunnyUK
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PostPosted: Thu Nov 06, 2008 1:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I also fear that it's only a matter of time before an unnecessary law is passed to make it illegal to operate a PND while driving. As many has said, there are already laws in place dealing with dangerous driving or driving without due care - but these laws were also in place and able to deal with people causing accidents by using their mobile phones, and yet we got a separate law prohibiting the use of phones.

Society - and lawmakers - seems intent on creating new laws dealing with more and more specific matters rather than use already existing laws.
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BigPerk
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PostPosted: Thu Nov 06, 2008 5:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The mobile phone prohibition is to prevent accidents, rather than to prosecute someone once they have had one. I know - I've nearly been consigned to the mortuary on at least 2 occasions where the driver was totally oblivious to everything around them, so although they didn't actually have an accident because I saw them first (and they didn't even realise they'd done something extremely dangerous) they were definitely driving lethally!

Although the police can pull someone up if they believe they do not have proper control of their vehicle, I guess it's more arguable to prove that, than it is to prove they were carrying out an action specifically prohibited by law. But in any case it's so rarely enforced even now, that user levels seem to have gone right up again anyway.

As for PNDs, I suspect they are so vital to the emergency services these days (including the police) it would be pretty unlikely they would actually be banned completely. Maybe a stronger restriction on actually handling one extensively without pulling over, stopping and turning the engine off could be more likely, very similar to the situation with non-hands-free phones in fact. Garnin's safety feature , though optional at present, is still quite a good idea.
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999tommo
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PostPosted: Wed Nov 12, 2008 3:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

There is every likelihood in the future that the use of PNDs when driving will be legislated against. At the moment though, there have not been sufficient studies to prove that using them whilst driving is unsafe. Logic tells you it is unsafe, but there is no physical proof. THe mobile phone legislation was brought in to act as a deterrent, by giving three points and a 60 fine, similar to a basic speeding offence. The hope was that when people started getting points, they would think twice about using the phone whilst driving. Unfortunately it doesn't seem to have worked. I stop people almost daily and have been instrumental in at least two drivers being disqualified as a result.

As someone said, this could be dealt with using careless or dangerous driving offences, which already exist, but something drastic would have to happen before the offence would come to light and it might be too late for someone by then. The reason why there is a specific offence is because of the potential danger to other road users, rather than the actual dangers.

Some drivers whilst using phones are very perceptive, in that they spot the Police and put the phone down swiftly. Unfortunately this is not quick enough and they still get a ticket. Some drivers are clearly oblivious to all that is going on about them. Just the other day I stopped a guy who turned across in front of me and didn't see me. I turned and followed him and when signalled to stop, it took him almost 30 seconds to react. Bearing in mind I was driving a fluorescent christmas tree of a car, that is quite worrying.
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