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DennisN
Tired Old Man
Joined: Feb 27, 2006
Posts: 14892
Location: Keynsham
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 Posted: Wed Jul 04, 2007 10:30 pm Post subject: Joined up thinking - NOT!! |
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Every time I buy a TV thingy (e.g. DVD player), I take some delight in completing the form which registers my purchase, so that I get a letter from the TV Licensing people saying I haven't got a licence and they know where every not licence lives and I can expect a visit from Der Gestapo soon. I ignore it and they send me a stronger one, saying Der Gestapo will bring Der Pincers to take out my fingernails. Eventually, they stop writing and no Gestapo arrives. I'm legal, because my partner has the licence in her name. Goes to show how good the TV Computer is - NOT.
However, when my van tax is running out, the renewal form allows me to re-tax it on line, because "they" know about my insurance (and MOT except I don't need that). The police have ANPR cameras that will grab you if you are missing insurance and MOT etc.
So why doesn't your insurance company know when you get points? They rely on you to ring them up and ask them to put up your premium because you've just got some points and a fine!! At best, your renewal notice eventually says you are supposed to tell them all relevant information.
Why don't you get your licence back VIA your insurance company when they send it back with your endorsement? Why doesn't the court require you to show an insurance renewal at that time, taking consideration of your misdemeanours? We all (well most of us) condemn those people who drive uninsured, yet they rarely pay an appropriate penalty. For EVERY uninsured and/or unlicensed driver, take away the vehicle and crush it, no options, no excuses, scrunch, scrunch, every trip! And just when will the police come round here and nick the maniac 18 year old opposite, riding one of those monkey motor bikes without tax, insurance, licence, helmet, silencer or a care in the world?? 
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Dennis
If it tastes good - it's fattening.
Two of them are obesiting!! |
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Stargate2006
Banned
Joined: Sep 02, 2006
Posts: 236
Location: Essex
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| Posted: Wed Jul 04, 2007 11:07 pm Post subject: Re: Joined up thinking - NOT!! |
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| DennisN wrote: | Every time I buy a TV thingy (e.g. DVD player), I take some delight in completing the form which registers my purchase, so that I get a letter from the TV Licensing people saying I haven't got a licence and they know where every not licence lives and I can expect a visit from Der Gestapo soon. I ignore it and they send me a stronger one, saying Der Gestapo will bring Der Pincers to take out my fingernails. Eventually, they stop writing and no Gestapo arrives. I'm legal, because my partner has the licence in her name. Goes to show how good the TV Computer is - NOT.
However, when my van tax is running out, the renewal form allows me to re-tax it on line, because "they" know about my insurance (and MOT except I don't need that). The police have ANPR cameras that will grab you if you are missing insurance and MOT etc.
So why doesn't your insurance company know when you get points? They rely on you to ring them up and ask them to put up your premium because you've just got some points and a fine!! At best, your renewal notice eventually says you are supposed to tell them all relevant information.
Why don't you get your licence back VIA your insurance company when they send it back with your endorsement? Why doesn't the court require you to show an insurance renewal at that time, taking consideration of your misdemeanours? We all (well most of us) condemn those people who drive uninsured, yet they rarely pay an appropriate penalty. For EVERY uninsured and/or unlicensed driver, take away the vehicle and crush it, no options, no excuses, scrunch, scrunch, every trip! And just when will the police come round here and nick the maniac 18 year old opposite, riding one of those monkey motor bikes without tax, insurance, licence, helmet, silencer or a care in the world?? |
Anyone's who are not happy with the maniac 18 year old or under age teen  around doing nothing better thing to do. 
SACK ALL THE BRITISH GOVERNMENT OUT NOW FOR MESSING IT UP OF HAVING A LAUGH AT US  |
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RQ
Regular Visitor
Joined: Apr 08, 2006
Posts: 240
Location: Clevedon
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| Posted: Wed Jul 04, 2007 11:16 pm Post subject: |
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If they added X pence to the cost of fuel to cover the cost of 3rd party insurance - then everyone would be insured. We would not have the problem with people not being insured and then getting fined when caught. This would stop the waste of police time checking whether someone is insured and dealing with masses of red tape when they discover a defaulter. It would save court time. It would save a lot of angst when someone discovers that their car is not going to be fixed and paid for by the person causing the bump.
It seems to cure a few things.
If you wanted comprehensive cover then you could take out the extra cover yourself with the insurance companies.
But it could get even better. If they also added a further X pence to cover the road fund license you could get rid of most of the DVLA and that ridiculous £80 fine because you haven't got a road fund license. And you could save police time etc.etc The government could save money by getting rid of that stupid computer system they spent millions on and use it for something useful - a paperweight or a bottom of lake decoration - rather than working out who has not paid for their road fund.
And everyone would be happier.
Also it would be fairer because the more miles people do the more they pay.
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RQ
TT1v3 6.560 1713 UK&NI 660.1199
TTG700 6.520 1387 MoWE 660.1219 |
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DennisN
Tired Old Man
Joined: Feb 27, 2006
Posts: 14892
Location: Keynsham
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| Posted: Wed Jul 04, 2007 11:52 pm Post subject: |
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| RQ wrote: | | If they added X pence to the cost of fuel |
One Million percent right.  And it would make (comprehensive) insurance a business instead of a ripoff.
There is only one item not covered by this and it's the roadworthyness aspect. The DVLA relicensing includes MOT check. Overcome that obstacle and you've got the answer to the universe and everything.
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Dennis
If it tastes good - it's fattening.
Two of them are obesiting!! |
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Darren
Frequent Visitor
Joined: 11/07/2002 14:36:40
Posts: 23848
Location: Hampshire, UK
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| Posted: Thu Jul 05, 2007 7:42 am Post subject: |
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Why should the insurance company care about your points? If you fail to declare them your policy becomes void and they pocket the full fee! It's simply not in their interest
We should also have an insurance 'disc' on display as they do in many other countries and we should be forced to carry our drivers licence. This would resolve many of the roadside identity queries.
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Darren Griffin |
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Skippy
Pocket GPS Verifier
Joined: 24/06/2003 00:22:12
Posts: 2946
Location: Escaped to the Antipodies! 36.83°S 174.75°E
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| Posted: Thu Jul 05, 2007 8:18 am Post subject: |
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| RQ wrote: | | If they added X pence to the cost of fuel to cover the cost of 3rd party insurance - then everyone would be insured. |
It's a good idea but it does mean that otherwise uninsurable person with a history of crashing cars, drink driving, car theft and dangerous driving can still be covered. 
There are two ways to look at this,
1. It covers the innocent victims of drivers who would be otherwise uninsured (so it's a good thing)
2. It allows drivers who would otherwise be unable to get insurance to get back on the road (which is a bad thing)
I would prefer that these irresponsible people found it impossible to get insurance and they were forced off the road completely.
My take on it is thus:
1. The tax disc brings revenue but costs money to collect, administer and enforce. Get rid of it put 5p a litre on fuel to make up for the lost revenue.
2. Order insurance companies to issue insurance discs to be used in place of the old tax disc. Have a cryptograpically signed bar code on the insurance disc which would could be scanned using a roadside scanner and would make it virtually impossible to force or tamper with the disc.
3. The current £200 fine for driving without insurance is a joke and no deterrent when you can't insure a anything for less than £500 in London. Increase the standard fine for driving without insurance to be calculated as TWICE the cost of third party only insurance for the vehicle.
4. Setup more enforcement checkpoints and impound the cars of people without insurance, cloned plates or no registered keeper.
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bettyboo
Regular Visitor
Joined: Jun 03, 2007
Posts: 121
Location: Bournemouth, Dorset
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| Posted: Thu Jul 05, 2007 8:34 am Post subject: |
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I suppose some of you might have that Jade Goody was given a six month driving ban for driving on a provisional licence, and having no insurance, she got 14 points and a 6 month ban!!!!!
That is just not enough of a punishment, is it because she is a bit of a celebrity, the fine she got was over a thousand pounds but thats pocket change to her. I think there should be a prison sentance for people who do that, no matter who you are, and banned from driving for life. |
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mostdom
Pocket GPS Moderator
Joined: Jul 10, 2006
Posts: 1964
Location: Surrey, UK.
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| Posted: Thu Jul 05, 2007 8:44 am Post subject: |
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If you don't declare something relevant you may not be insured. If you wanted to rant about those who have no insurance, then essetially everyone who has undeclared points on thier licence are also uninsured.
Russian roulet anyone! 
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Dom
HERE LIES PND May it rest in peace.
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DennisN
Tired Old Man
Joined: Feb 27, 2006
Posts: 14892
Location: Keynsham
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| Posted: Thu Jul 05, 2007 8:46 am Post subject: |
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| Darren wrote: | | Why should the insurance company care about your points? If you fail to declare them your policy becomes void and they pocket the full fee! It's simply not in their interest |
But what happens to anybody like my brother, head injury, wheelchair bound and eating through a tube in his stomach for the last eight years and the rest of his life without any compensation?
bettyboo Jade Goody got a very heavy punishment compared with all the cases I see on telly. Not that hers was excessive, just that most are nowhere near enough. And yes, she and all the others should go to jail and have their cars crunched (no excuse that it's not their car, borrowed or anything).
And these uninsured people who get to keep their cars by having somebody else go collect it on their insurance should have it crunched too.
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Dennis
If it tastes good - it's fattening.
Two of them are obesiting!! |
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DennisN
Tired Old Man
Joined: Feb 27, 2006
Posts: 14892
Location: Keynsham
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| Posted: Thu Jul 05, 2007 8:54 am Post subject: |
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Apologies for any misleading - my brother did get compensation (I don't know how much) because his driver was insured, but it took almost eight years because insurance companies have no intention of paying out if they can avoid it. But there are other people in his position who won't get compensation from their uninsured drivers. xx pence on fuel would eliminate that and might even shorten the time taken to decide on the amount of compensation.
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Dennis
If it tastes good - it's fattening.
Two of them are obesiting!! |
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Darren
Frequent Visitor
Joined: 11/07/2002 14:36:40
Posts: 23848
Location: Hampshire, UK
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| Posted: Thu Jul 05, 2007 9:06 am Post subject: |
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| bettyboo wrote: | | I suppose some of you might have that Jade Goody was given a six month driving ban for driving on a provisional licence, and having no insurance, she got 14 points and a 6 month ban!!!!! |
Indeed it's pathetic. The courts dish out fines for no insurance that are less then the insurance would have cost so where is the incentive to get insured! At least now they confiscate cars, I wish I'd had the power to do that.
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Darren Griffin |
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Darren
Frequent Visitor
Joined: 11/07/2002 14:36:40
Posts: 23848
Location: Hampshire, UK
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| Posted: Thu Jul 05, 2007 9:10 am Post subject: |
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| DennisN wrote: | | But what happens to anybody like my brother, head injury, wheelchair bound and eating through a tube in his stomach for the last eight years and the rest of his life without any compensation? |
I see you've answered that he did receive compensation but in the event that the driver wasn't insured there would be grounds for a criminal injuries compensation payout.
I'm not defending them, as an ex-Police Traffic Officer I abhor the plague of uninsured, unlicensed drivers and would like to see many more ANPR sites.
A former colleague of mine still serving drives on the M6 in an ANPR equipped patrol car. He told me that on occasion he will get 10+ hits in an hour and simply doesn't have enough time to stop them all. Granted some may simply be out of data info, newly registered etc but most are uninsured, unregistered vehicles.
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Darren Griffin |
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theripper
Pocket GPS Verifier
Joined: Feb 07, 2006
Posts: 581
Location: Medway Towns, Kent
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| Posted: Thu Jul 05, 2007 10:55 am Post subject: |
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Putting xx pence on a litre of fuel will never happen whilst the powers that be still ride around ig large gas guzzling cars because they would be hit the hardest(also what about transport companies whose lorries do hundreds of thousands of miles per year- (DennisN springs to mind) )
theripper |
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bettyboo
Regular Visitor
Joined: Jun 03, 2007
Posts: 121
Location: Bournemouth, Dorset
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| Posted: Thu Jul 05, 2007 11:05 am Post subject: |
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I thought the police did have the power to get cars crushed if there is no tax on them, surely if you have no tax that means you have no insurance. I have watched police programmes on telly and when they pull someone up who cant produce the right documents they radio in and find out if they are legal on the road, if not then they send them on their way minus the car and call for the tow truck. Then they have the cars crushed.
I didnt realise that the cars could be collected by someone who is insured to drive it. |
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theripper
Pocket GPS Verifier
Joined: Feb 07, 2006
Posts: 581
Location: Medway Towns, Kent
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| Posted: Thu Jul 05, 2007 11:12 am Post subject: |
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bettyboo
I watched one of those programs as well and one of them actually stated that his friend collected the car a couple of days later.
theripper |
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