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Speed Camera Database to Turn Professional
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Wishlist
Lifetime Member


Joined: Mar 10, 2005
Posts: 160

PostPosted: Sat Dec 24, 2005 1:34 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hmm, I am a receiver of the database rather than a giver of info. I truly thank the 700 givers in this world and I would have thought that I speak for the many thousands of us takers out here when I say we really appreciate the effort that you have put in for us with the community sprit. There have been a few times when the database has saved my bacon during a momentary lapse of concentration at the wrong "moment" and no doubt I am not the only one.

If I am honest I have to say that I was feeling guilty that I had not done my part to add to the community yet, and I have made some alterations to my copy of the database. Embarassed

From a personal point of view itís too late now though as the community sprit and magic of belonging to one has just been erased it would appear. I guess I was too slow (for slow read lazy or any other number of similar expressive words) to really feel the need because the 700 were doing such a good job.

OK so Now I feel bad about not doing my bit and loosing something that I always hovered around without actually joining in. Sad Human nature, itís natural to want something you lost or nearly had in my case!

So I now have a desire to really get stuck in to the community. So when the community sorts itself out again and regroups wherever that may be, I have some updates that I would like to post. My only concern is where that community will be! Sad
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xda
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Joined: Mar 11, 2004
Posts: 1199
Location: Park Gate

PostPosted: Sat Dec 24, 2005 2:35 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Darren wrote:
What are the thoughts from those who have submitted data in the past if we were to grant them free access?

I would consider it a bonus.
As regards the copyright and to as who owns the data, surely by uploading submissions /Corrections etc. you are agreeing for that information to be added to the database otherwise why upload it in the first place.
I have uploaded wav files for the speed related cameras, as well as 3 POI files for the download area, Do I own the copyright - I don't know or really care, they were made available for everyone to use.
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Graham.
TT Go720, App:9.510(1234792.1) OS:842337
GPS: V1.20, Boot: 5.5279, Home: V2.9.5.3093
Map: Europe V910.4892
Map: Europe_Truck V870.3421, Kingston 8GB SD
Nokia 925 Windows 8
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xda
Lifetime Member


Joined: Mar 11, 2004
Posts: 1199
Location: Park Gate

PostPosted: Sat Dec 24, 2005 3:18 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Darren wrote:
Tim Buxton wrote:
I know Darren said he'd look into it, but I remembered. The .wav files were removed, as they aren't necessary with TTN5. I wonder if they should be placed in the Downloads section for V3 users.

Gawd! Of course, grey matter's failing me Sad

I'm not sure how many v3 users remain but we can re-instate those as a seperate download if there is interest.


Darren they or on here for those that need them, as well as the instuctions of how to install them with CheckPOInt V2. which is there. As well as the 3POI files I sent to you.
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Graham.
TT Go720, App:9.510(1234792.1) OS:842337
GPS: V1.20, Boot: 5.5279, Home: V2.9.5.3093
Map: Europe V910.4892
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technik
Lifetime Member


Joined: Mar 18, 2004
Posts: 788
Location: Midlands UK

PostPosted: Sat Dec 24, 2005 3:25 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Having recently used the Pocket GPS Database, I would not trust it to keep your licence clean !

Fortunately my Road Angel speaks the truth as I would expect a commercial product to.

The PocketGPSworld database should remain free of charge, as legally it is not up to the job.
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Andycambs
Regular Visitor


Joined: Jan 02, 2005
Posts: 68

PostPosted: Sat Dec 24, 2005 8:06 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

technik wrote:
Having recently used the Pocket GPS Database, I would not trust it to keep your licence clean !

Fortunately my Road Angel speaks the truth as I would expect a commercial product to.

The PocketGPSworld database should remain free of charge, as legally it is not up to the job.

An extremely good point - which i have mentioned before, inasmuch that if you find inaccuracies in the database, will the fees be refunded?

I've read people's comments, and I agree, whereas before readers are happy to provide the information to share amongst others, when it is to be charged for and a profit made, there may be a reluctance to do this. It's scarcely likely that PGPSW can employ someone to check and validate every camera location, not just in England, Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland, but also the rest of Europe each and every month.

If you are going to provide the download on a commercial basis, then there is an expectation of accuracy.

To me, the amount of the charge is immaterial, it's the fact that a charge is being made for work done by members who wanted to share this with others.
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s7uar7
Banned


Joined: Nov 17, 2005
Posts: 12

PostPosted: Sat Dec 24, 2005 11:11 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

PocketGPSWorld are quite happy to use other people's efforts for free by using PHP, and (I presume) Apache, MySQL & Linux for their website. It's ironic that they would start charging for a similar community-built project.
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Darren
Pocket GPS Staff
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Joined: 11/07/2002 14:36:40
Posts: 23848
Location: Hampshire, UK

PostPosted: Sat Dec 24, 2005 11:36 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

ccsnet wrote:
Darren - I think for the sake of every body here you should set some expectations as to when an offical anouncement will be put out rather than saying its been looked at... at the least may be a progress report to say how far along you are to get to that anouncement.

We hope to have a response with an outline of our proposals by then Thursday.
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Darren
Pocket GPS Staff
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Joined: 11/07/2002 14:36:40
Posts: 23848
Location: Hampshire, UK

PostPosted: Sat Dec 24, 2005 11:38 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Andycambs wrote:
An extremely good point - which i have mentioned before, inasmuch that if you find inaccuracies in the database, will the fees be refunded?

Do you think Snooper, RoadAngel, Morpheous or any other commercial operators offer a refund on such situations? No and they will have taken £50+ of you.

Indeed all these operators accept user submissions and none of them offer any reward or credit for submission.
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Unplugged
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Joined: Jul 31, 2005
Posts: 142
Location: Northampton

PostPosted: Sat Dec 24, 2005 11:40 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

xda wrote:
Darren wrote:
What are the thoughts from those who have submitted data in the past if we were to grant them free access?

I would consider it a bonus.
As regards the copyright and to as who owns the data, surely by uploading submissions /Corrections etc. you are agreeing for that information to be added to the database otherwise why upload it in the first place.
I have uploaded wav files for the speed related cameras, as well as 3 POI files for the download area, Do I own the copyright - I don't know or really care, they were made available for everyone to use.


I think the issue here is that yes we all submitted data but it was for a good cause the greeater good and now its kind of a slap in the face that they have turned round and announced this.

I can see why they need to cover their costs but anything more than doing so is profiteering out of the free submissions of others. Submissions we all thought we were doing for a Free Community Project.
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TheBoyGroucho
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Joined: 19/08/2002 15:39:36
Posts: 172
Location: United Kingdom

PostPosted: Sat Dec 24, 2005 11:47 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Darren wrote:
TheBoyGroucho wrote:
True again....However if as you contend the raw data cannot be copyrighted then the raw data can be taken from the database and used for whatever purpose by anyone.


Obviously we have taken advice on our Copyright position. It would be a mockery of any Copyright if such protection did not cater for the possibility of such a simple ruse would it not?


Absolutely and my apologies... I misinterpreted some information given to me.
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TheBoyGroucho
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Joined: 19/08/2002 15:39:36
Posts: 172
Location: United Kingdom

PostPosted: Sat Dec 24, 2005 12:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

xda wrote:
As regards the copyright and to as who owns the data, surely by uploading submissions /Corrections etc. you are agreeing for that information to be added to the database otherwise why upload it in the first place.


AIUI thats not quite how it works...Data was provided for use, subject to an understanding/agreement (which actually translates to a contract under English contract law) with certain implicit and explicit conditions attached. To vary those conditions requires the consent of all parties.
For the data to have become the property of Pocketgps one of the explicit conditions would have to have been that by submitting the data the ownership (copyright, Interlectual property or whatever) of it would pass to Pocketgps.
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NoLCD
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Joined: Nov 06, 2005
Posts: 48
Location: Shropshire

PostPosted: Sat Dec 24, 2005 1:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

For Garmin i3 owners the option to upload camera postions is not so easy so they will be penalised in a free-to-contibutors database, a copy of Mapsource or a slow cross check with streetmap or multimap is the only way.
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Lost Cause
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Joined: 06/06/2003 10:17:21
Posts: 57
Location: United Kingdom

PostPosted: Sat Dec 24, 2005 1:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I have been an avid follower of this website for a good few years now, and have found it to be a fantastic resource. Rarely a day goes past without visiting, though I rarely contribute - and I`m ashamed to say I`ve never contributed to the camera database.

The work of the team is incredible and we`d all literally be lost without it. So no harsh words will be spoken here.

My heart tells me that this charging situation is wrong. My head tells me that the database will become less accurate because of it.

Personally, I suspect that (given that over 700 people have contributed more than once) if the team had made a statement along the lines of `This has become too big. We can`t handle it anymore. It`s the end`, then there would have been plenty of volunteers raising their hands to help. I could be wrong, or maybe not.

When called to action to continue a popular thing - whatever that may be - it`s surprising how much goodwill is out there methinks. Especially for this gem of a site.
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soweezy
Pocket GPS Verifier
Pocket GPS Verifier


Joined: Jan 31, 2005
Posts: 324
Location: UK

PostPosted: Sat Dec 24, 2005 1:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Lost Cause wrote:
When called to action to continue a popular thing - whatever that may be - it`s surprising how much goodwill is out there methinks. Especially for this gem of a site.

too true, I've already offered to confirm cam sites in my area.
I know for a fact there are a few cameras shown in the wrong place, by at least 50metres and there are others in need of a speed rating

it seems really sad sitting here on Xmas Eve, but you have to do something to pass the time waiting for clients to arrive... and they're never on time !!!

Merry Christmas all :D
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fishmad
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Joined: Dec 21, 2005
Posts: 35
Location: Preston, Lancashire.

PostPosted: Sat Dec 24, 2005 1:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

A charge of £2 is more than reasonable imo, perhaps won't download updates every month, possibly every other month would be a beter option for me. The more distance you cover the more you will need to update i guess. Wink
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