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HP Jornada 928

 
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Nigel Lloyd
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Joined: 08/05/2003 18:32:35
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Location: United Kingdom

PostPosted: Sun Sep 14, 2003 8:04 am    Post subject: HP Jornada 928 Reply with quote

I have an HP Jornada 928 WDA (combined phone & PDA), and would like to get a GPS system to use with it. I would like to use it:

- when travelling by public transport and walking round UK cities (mostly London)

- in car around UK (so preferably with voice as well as maps)

- while hiking in UK and possibly Poland and Greece (so preferably with use of contour maps)



I would appreciate advice on what to buy.

Issues seem to be:

- there is only 64Mb RAM & one CF type 1 slot, which makes it difficult to hold the maps & use a CF GPS.

- does the 928 use the same cable as other Jornadas (or in fact as any other more common PDA)?

- what software should one get, that can be cost effectively augmented when one goes to a new place.

- battery life is short.

I have made myself a battery pack with 8xAA cells and a car lighter socket to supplement the short battery life, so presumably I could use a mouse system rather than a CF. Price is very much a constraint.



Finally, I wonder whether Cambridge Positioning Systems have a cheap alternative to satellite? I piloted an early version of theirs on my mobile phone about 3 years ago for Vodafone.



Sorry this is long & involved.

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Nigel Lloyd
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Joined: 08/05/2003 18:32:35
Posts: 14
Location: United Kingdom

PostPosted: Sun Sep 14, 2003 8:04 am    Post subject: HP Jornada 928 Reply with quote

I have just received this reply to my query from 4 days ago from TomTom:



Dear Nigel,

Thanks for your mail.

Our software is not compatible with the HP Jornada 928 and we have currently no plans to release a compatible version. However we have filed your suggestion and we will use it as input for a future release.

Regards,

TomTom Customer Services

[email protected]

http://www.tomtom.com

---- Original message

Subject: Will TomTom work on the HP Jornada 928?

> Received: Monday 02-06-2003

> Time: 22:39

> ----------------------------------------------

> Machine: Hewlett Packard Jornada 928 WDA

> OS: Windows CE

> Version:PocketPC

> ----------------------------------------------

> I want to buy the TomTom Navigator 2 GPS, software and maps, for use with my HP Jornada 928 (operating system: Pocket PC 2002). None of the vendors list it as compatible although they list other Jornada models. Can you reassure me that it will work with my Jornada 928?

> What cable do I need? Will it work successfully with a Compact Flash GPS (I am concerned that there will be nowhere for the data to be stored) or with your new Bluetooth system?

> ----------------------------------------------

> [The steps taken to resolve the issue]

> looked at every website I could find

> ----------------------------------------------

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Dave
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Joined: Sep 10, 2003
Posts: 6460
Location: UK

PostPosted: Sun Sep 14, 2003 8:04 am    Post subject: HP Jornada 928 Reply with quote

Nigel, I don't know if this is specific to TTN2 or to TTN in general, but I've had a lot of people email me saying TomTom say they don't support the 928, and yet several people have tried TTN1 and it works fine. For some reason TomTom think because the processor is WDA emulating ARM and not ARM itself, that there is an issue here and it won't be compatible. I've also received several emails from other users saying the 5xx Jornada cables work fine with the 928.



Now that was with TTN1, I don't know if TTN2 will work with the 928.



Perhaps other 928 users can jump in here and let me know ?
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Pc-Mobile
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Joined: 26/10/2002 10:38:36
Posts: 789
Location: Hong Kong

PostPosted: Sun Sep 14, 2003 8:04 am    Post subject: HP Jornada 928 Reply with quote

TTN1 should work, do not know about TTN2 though. But I have a feeling that it might work.



Does TTN2 has a big advantage over TTN1?

I doubt it particularly if the price difference is big (assuming that you can still get TTN1).



Cable is the same as 54/56x series, if you are connecting a standalone GPS.



Why make a 8xAA pack? You can get a ready made battery extender (4xAA), again the same as 54/56x series.




_________________
Pc-Mobile
http://pc-mobile.net/gps.htm
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Dave
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PostPosted: Sun Sep 14, 2003 8:04 am    Post subject: HP Jornada 928 Reply with quote

As far as I'm aware from a software perspective, the WDA supports ARM emluation, just as much as the XScale supports ARM emulation/support, so I don't think there will be a problem. I do agree with the 54x/56x cables to standalone, this is what I've heard. I think Nigel has just had the bad luck of getting hold of someone at TomTom who knows nothing about the 928 WDA.
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DavidW
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Joined: 17/05/2003 02:26:21
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PostPosted: Sun Sep 14, 2003 8:04 am    Post subject: HP Jornada 928 Reply with quote

There seems to be a lot of people mistakenly (so far as I can tell) saying various processors used in Pocket PCs (like the XScales, or the OMAP processors used in many Pocket PC phones) emulate an ARM rather than actually being an ARM.



If anyone wants a fairly technical discussion of this issue that I wrote in microsoft.public.pocketpc, click here.





The ARM core is available for licensing in all sorts of designs, which is why you can get it with other things on the same chip, whether it's Intel's enhancements in the XScales, or features that make it very suitable for a Pocket PC Phone in TI's OMAP series.



They are real ARM cores. Emulation is not going on here - they're just chips that contain an ARM core as well as other bits and pieces.





Look at it another way up. When a real ARM contains rather less than a million transistors (which is tiny compared to something like a Pentium 4), why, when you're after the best possible performance on a device like a Pocket PC, would you emulate the main processor?







So long as you have suitable I/O and memory on the Jornada 928, I see no reason why TomTom Navigator 2 shouldn't work. Why not try TomTom Maps Online first, which will cost you nothing - then see if you can borrow a GPS from someone to use with Maps Online. If that combination will work, there's no reason why Navigator shouldn't.



There's certainly no problem with Navigator on the XDA, and the XDA runs Pocket PC 2002 Phone Edition as well.





The only potential issue I can think of is whether there's some problem with the HP wireless software, either in terms of creating software incompatibilities or leaving insufficient main memory. I doubt it on both counts, though I can't be sure.



Maybe you could press TomTom to say precisely what they feel the problem is with the Jornada 928.







David
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Nigel Lloyd
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Joined: 08/05/2003 18:32:35
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PostPosted: Sun Sep 14, 2003 8:04 am    Post subject: HP Jornada 928 Reply with quote

Many thanks for all this expertise. It's bizarre that manufacturers try so hard not to sell their wares.



To try to resolve all the issues:

1. can one use a compact flash GPS with the Jornada 928? I've decided that since the CF GPS don't appear to have spare storage on the CF in which to hold the maps, and the Jornada has no other storage available, then this was not an option.

2. how do I get software for Eastern Europe? I'll put this as a new post.

3. I've only been able to find battery extender packs for HP Jornadas on http://www.scheerwholesale.com in the USA.

4. I've discovered that the alternative (which I believe was started by Cambridge Positioning Systems) is now being offered commercially by companies which for a small fee will tell you the location of a mobile phone.

http://www.fleetonline.net/

http://www.verilocation.com/



In the meantime I've gone ahead and bought Destinator 2 UK & Europe software (47.95 +2.50 delivery) through ebay, because it was so much cheaper than TomTom.

I've also bought an unbranded SIRF2 GPS receiver from Orbiton Technology (84.99 + 20 RS232 sync cable for the Jornada + 4 delivery). I'll let you know how well it all works, when it arrives and is set up.



Many thanks again, and I hope this helps others.



Nigel
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Dave
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Joined: Sep 10, 2003
Posts: 6460
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PostPosted: Sun Sep 14, 2003 8:04 am    Post subject: HP Jornada 928 Reply with quote

1. Take a look at our GPS Hardware tables and look on the 2nd and 3rd tables for the HP Jornada 928 WDA. You could use a Type I GPS CF Card, the problem is you won't have any storage slots left for maps, which will be nearly useless. You can go with an in-car setup that plugs into the bottom sync port, or you could use a handheld GPS Receiver with a cable supplied by PC-Mobile and connect this to the 928.



2. I think you'll have problems with this, Western Europe is covered very well, but Eastern Europe needs working on.
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Nigel Lloyd
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Joined: 08/05/2003 18:32:35
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Location: United Kingdom

PostPosted: Sun Sep 14, 2003 8:04 am    Post subject: HP Jornada 928 Reply with quote

Well it works!

I had a problem initially with the gps because the cable was faulty, but it was diagnosed and repaired by the vendor and has worked beautifully in this country and Berlin. I'm about to test it in Vienna and Brussels too.



The Destinator 2 software works fine. I've bought a 0.5GB CF to store the mapping on.



Now I'm looking for Polish mapping. I'm also planning to put a plug and socket onto the GPS power cable so that it can either be powered (in-car) from the cigarette lighter power socket, or (when walking) from a battery extender.



Many thanks for everybody's help.

Best regards,

Nigel
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