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eBay and Other Sites Offering Our Safety Camera Database
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UncleBob
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Joined: May 02, 2005
Posts: 8
Location: Hampshire, UK

PostPosted: Mon Aug 22, 2005 1:53 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Could someone who has purchased the TomTom database not "open" it up and compare it with the Lon/Lat settings of our database. That way you can find out for sure who's hard work it really was.

What I'm trying to say is remember what happened with the AA when they nicked OS maps and used it for their own. They got caught out by "fingerprints" on the maps (certain roads that does not exist etc.) and had to pay Ordinance Survey millions back.

...just a thought.

Personally I have not contibuted to any new additions as the roads I normally used are allready covered by the database, but it annoys me as well when someone takes a group's effords and sell it off as their own.

On the other hand as a consumer you also feel screwed afterwards when you finally learn the truth.

Happens to us all doesn't it? You buy a product that you think is a real bargain or value for money just to find out a few days later that you have over paid and all other retailers sold that product for half the price or, as in this case, for free.
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gsxr1000
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Joined: Mar 14, 2005
Posts: 66

PostPosted: Mon Aug 22, 2005 2:04 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

all things considered my view is to charge and encrypt the file with a unlock key sent via email to unlock for install or similar......

its great it being free but if you ask the question who will lose out if it is no longer free - then the answer is the peolpe who wouldnt consider buying it anyway so nothing lost there

and for the people who do buy it - proceeds go to your good cause
it really is a win/win situation for the good of the site, with like i said earlier, members who contribute info re new camera sites given a concession.

its obvious that people are benefitting from the teams hard work and on the balance companies are too, some who are posting mega profits

this needs marketing properly now - where else can this information be found for all platforms - i struggle to think, just here

get wise team.......
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gsxr1000
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Joined: Mar 14, 2005
Posts: 66

PostPosted: Mon Aug 22, 2005 2:07 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

further....

just look back to clone cd
it started as a snide ripping tool that would copy anythong - totally politicaly incorrect.

now...

they have gone big and cleaned up their act and now clone cd is a big legitimate seller, no longer a warez download
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robertn
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Joined: Feb 06, 2005
Posts: 564

PostPosted: Mon Aug 22, 2005 3:06 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I found these looking for the 'Navman'
5799881083
5798445147

And this one blatently copies the text of your review of the iCN650.
5800715086
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cootuk
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Joined: Jul 17, 2005
Posts: 38

PostPosted: Mon Aug 22, 2005 4:46 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/6030048

Tiffany sued Ebay last year over the sheer number of fakes on offer as they had to employ people to trawl through Ebay trying to unmask all the fake auctions.

I don't know what the outcome of that was, but Ebay seems to believe they have little responsibility over listings. If they were to vet each listing then their profits would tumble as the number of listings would be reduced by an order of magnitude.

Even so I've reported a few fake Route66 auctions, but the seller is merrily relisting tens of auctions.
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SimonCatlin
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Joined: Jan 11, 2004
Posts: 565
Location: London

PostPosted: Mon Aug 22, 2005 7:32 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Darren wrote:
They claim to have employed a team of students as data collectors to collect the data. Make of that what you will. 6000+ locations in a few months. Possible I suppose at a push.

Of course there are other ways of getting your base data ;)


Darren,

I know you have hinted at this before, and as contributor to the database I feel we need to stop this; can we not introduce a few highly clever FAKE cameras, such as the Ordance Survey did (see above)?

Any students out there want to corroborate TomTom's response? Did you get asked to send in the locations of Speed Cameras? I very much doubt it....
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Darren
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Joined: 11/07/2002 14:36:40
Posts: 23848
Location: Hampshire, UK

PostPosted: Mon Aug 22, 2005 8:36 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

UncleBob wrote:
Could someone who has purchased the TomTom database not "open" it up and compare it with the Lon/Lat settings of our database.

TomTom encrypt their PLUS Service databases no it isn't an option let alone ethical! I'm not suggesting they used our database, there are too many innacuracies and omissions for that to have been the case. But I do wonder if they physically verified each site as they claim.
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Darren Griffin
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Darren
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PostPosted: Mon Aug 22, 2005 8:38 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

robertn wrote:
I found these looking for the 'Navman'
5799881083
5798445147

And this one blatently copies the text of your review of the iCN650.
5800715086

5799881083 is clearly a scam, unverified seller from China, rediculously cheap price, stock shot and ripped of description!

5798445147 is a greay area, if its a new boxed product then technically a breach, if 2nd hand then not.

And 5800715086 has previously been reported, doubtless eBay don't action
at the weekend so there may be some cancellations today.
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Darren Griffin
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Darren
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PostPosted: Mon Aug 22, 2005 8:42 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

SimonCatlin wrote:
I know you have hinted at this before, and as contributor to the database I feel we need to stop this; can we not introduce a few highly clever FAKE cameras, such as the Ordance Survey did (see above)?

As I clarified earlier, we don't suspect TomTom of using our data as their database has too many errors that aren't in ours. Where there cameras do exist though, in fairness to TomTom they are clearly on the correct side of the road and in most cases exactly where they really are, i.e. a few feet to the side of the verge, which indicates a level of accuracy when recording locations. I just find it dificult to contemplate how they physically verified 6000 camera sites or how they intend to do this moving forwards.

As for 'dummy' sites. We have them already, always have done and this makes it a very simple process to identify our data even when it has been massaged in some way.
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kayble
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Joined: Mar 03, 2005
Posts: 2

PostPosted: Mon Aug 22, 2005 10:22 am    Post subject: possible offender Reply with quote

I think that www.globalpositioningsystems.co.uk might be an offender in this instance. Take a look at this link and scroll down to the Ipaq HW6515. There is an incentive to download a 'FREE SPEED CAMERA DATABASE DOWNLOAD'.
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vmlopes
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Joined: 18/07/2003 14:27:27
Posts: 22

PostPosted: Mon Aug 22, 2005 10:30 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Check this site out, tomtom files and maps being swapped constantly.

http://www.3g.co.uk/3GForum/forumdisplay.php?f=387
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Darren
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Joined: 11/07/2002 14:36:40
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Location: Hampshire, UK

PostPosted: Mon Aug 22, 2005 10:33 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Global Positioning Systems have sought our permission to use the database but I have asked them to make it clear that we are the source. Whilst they have done this on one page I do think they being rather disingenuous in making no mention anywhere else.

We permit retailers to offer a pre-install camera database service as an incentive so long as they apply for a licence and ensure clear credit is given to this site. However, a few have either not applied for a licence or are not abiding by the acknowledgment requirements. In some cases this leads buyers to believe they are getting something different.

We are taking action on this and as I have mooted earlier, we will name and shame those who do not abide by our terms.
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Pocketgps
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Joined: Nov 16, 2004
Posts: 2145
Location: Midlands, UK

PostPosted: Mon Aug 22, 2005 11:09 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

A web site I used some time ago had a HALL OF SHAME page, it listed all the people and web sites found to be using its files without permission, then a colum for those who had then complied and apologized.
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Darren
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Location: Hampshire, UK

PostPosted: Mon Aug 22, 2005 11:11 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Pocketgps wrote:
A web site I used some time ago had a HALL OF SHAME page, it listed all the people and web sites found to be using its files without permission, then a colum for those who had then complied and apologized.

I like it Twisted Evil
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StevenGourlay
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Joined: Sep 28, 2004
Posts: 808
Location: Ullapool

PostPosted: Mon Aug 22, 2005 4:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

5801063370
5801513589
5801284897
Are some more
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