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stefanoza Occasional Visitor
Joined: Jan 02, 2007 Posts: 3
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Posted: Mon Jun 20, 2016 5:53 pm Post subject: Signing that penalty form, or not! |
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Recently my son received a penalty form for a jumping red light offence, the photo clearly shows a vehicle going through the red light. This was a work vehicle and when they received it my sons employers put his name on the form. My son did not think he was driving that particular vehicle (as there were other vehicles/drivers out that day and his employer did not track who was driving which vehicle at any specific time/day).
He filled in and signed the form (as the form says you are legally obliged to) and said he would go to court to contest the penalty, he enclosed a letter explaining why he believed he was innocent. The implication in the form is that signing it is NOT an admission of guilt if you opt to go to court. His letter explained the situation, expecting the police to think that as they couldn’t actually prove who was driving they would drop the case.
He went to court with a lawyer and supporting letters from his employer stating they could not be certain it was him driving but he received 3 points and a fine – for a penalty he truly believes he did not commit. So much for innocent until proven guilty!!
From what he described the court basically took the approach that he was guilty because he had signed the form.
Had he not signed the form and just sent the explanation letter back what would have happened?
What actually happens if you refuse to sign the form?
What is the best way to handle this kind of situation? |
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sussamb Pocket GPS Verifier
Joined: Mar 18, 2011 Posts: 4456 Location: West Sussex
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Posted: Mon Jun 20, 2016 6:17 pm Post subject: |
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I thought there was an option on the form to deny you were driving? Did he tick the wrong box perhaps? _________________ Where there's a will ... there's a way. |
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stefanoza Occasional Visitor
Joined: Jan 02, 2007 Posts: 3
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Posted: Mon Jun 20, 2016 6:51 pm Post subject: |
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as far as I recall you have to say it wasn't you and report another driver (mandatory otherwise you are breaking the law) or go to court... there is no other option offered. |
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sussamb Pocket GPS Verifier
Joined: Mar 18, 2011 Posts: 4456 Location: West Sussex
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Posted: Mon Jun 20, 2016 7:01 pm Post subject: |
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If there wasn't it may have been better not to have signed the form but returned it explaining why. It would then be referred back to your sons employer who would have needed to prove who was driving. _________________ Where there's a will ... there's a way. |
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Privateer Pocket GPS Moderator
Joined: 30/12/2002 17:36:20 Posts: 4912 Location: Oxfordshire, England, UK
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Posted: Tue Jun 21, 2016 11:54 am Post subject: Re: Signing that penalty form, or not! |
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stefanoza wrote: | He went to court with a lawyer and supporting letters from his employer stating they could not be certain it was him driving but he received 3 points and a fine – for a penalty he truly believes he did not commit. So much for innocent until proven guilty!! |
That result might lead one to presume that the courts and police don't care about innocence - just convictions.
stefanoza wrote: | Had he not signed the form and just sent the explanation letter back what would have happened?
What actually happens if you refuse to sign the form?
What is the best way to handle this kind of situation? |
I'm sorry to hear of the problems that your son has had, however I think that those questions are best answered by the professional lawyer that your son or his employer used as opposed to the "armchair lawyers" here .
If you get no response from them then try contacting another lawyer, Citizens Advice, or the website PePiPoo.
Please let us know what happens.
Regards, _________________ Robert.
iPhone 6s Plus, iOS 14.0.1: iOS CamerAlert v2.0.7
TomTom GO Mobile iOS 2.3.1; TomTom (UK & ROI and Europe) iOS apps v1.29
Garmin Camper 770 LMT-D |
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sussamb Pocket GPS Verifier
Joined: Mar 18, 2011 Posts: 4456 Location: West Sussex
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Posted: Tue Jun 21, 2016 3:21 pm Post subject: |
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Oi, who you calling an armchair lawyer? I'll have you know I always sit on a sofa _________________ Where there's a will ... there's a way. |
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M8TJT The Other Tired Old Man
Joined: Apr 04, 2006 Posts: 10118 Location: Bexhill, South Sussex, UK
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Posted: Tue Jun 21, 2016 3:25 pm Post subject: |
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Does that have twos and blues as well as your other chair? |
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sussamb Pocket GPS Verifier
Joined: Mar 18, 2011 Posts: 4456 Location: West Sussex
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Posted: Tue Jun 21, 2016 3:36 pm Post subject: |
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Nope, more of a dimmer light and TV sound _________________ Where there's a will ... there's a way. |
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IanS100 Frequent Visitor
Joined: May 05, 2008 Posts: 870 Location: Southport
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Posted: Tue Jun 21, 2016 5:33 pm Post subject: |
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stefanoza wrote: | as far as I recall you have to say it wasn't you and report another driver (mandatory otherwise you are breaking the law) or go to court... there is no other option offered. |
That will apply to the owner of the vehicle, an occasional driver cannot be expected to know who drives the vehicles at all times, that is the legal responsibility of the vehicle owner. _________________ Galaxy Note 4 / TomTom GO : CamerAlert : CoPilot |
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