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Navigon 8110 released
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mdimbleby
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Location: Lane End, Bucks

PostPosted: Sun Aug 31, 2008 9:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

That's the big question. I was a brands hatch today watching the DTM's (german TOCA). On the way home there was quite a few jams. three on the M25 and one on the M4. two were just slow traffic and others were accidents. (very heavy rain)I ingored the slow traffic but diverted the accidents. In all saved 15mins on the journey. not bad eh. You just have to judge it at the time. Tmc is a usefull tool are so road side electronic signs. TMC do not give times but the road signs do.
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DaveMatthews
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PostPosted: Mon Sep 01, 2008 12:50 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

mdimbleby wrote:
TMC do not give times


Well actually it does - as witnessed on TomTom units and others. Seemingly Navigon have chosen not to use that data, which, in my view, undermines the point of having TMC to a large degree.

What with this and the loss of the ability to plug in a proper TMC antenna to the latest Navigon units, I'm off to check out TT's latest range now!...

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BigPerk
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PostPosted: Wed Sep 10, 2008 1:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Having now done a fairly long trip, I have got some more issues to raise with Navigon. Before I go to them however, I would be grateful for any views, or advice where I have misused the facilities. As has been said, as many people should raise common problems so that Navigon know the problems are not just 'one-offs', so it seems sensible to publish my experiences in case others link them to their own. So here goes:

"NAVIGON QUERIES


Interim Destination & Add Route Point options when multiple choices are offered for a particular destination, such as for Calais or Metz, then if it is not obvious from the multiple choice list which is the right one, and 'show map' is chosen to check, then it is not possible to go back to the list and 'show map' for another choice - you are taken back to the 'enter city' screen and have to start the selection again for each choice you need to check. Also, trying to identify the correct choice on the Destination Search Map easily can be difficult, because on zoom-in, nearby places are not shown, and on zoom-out, the scale rapidly becomes too large and still with too few city names to compare with an atlas

Once an Interim Destination is selected it is not possible to delete it if a mistake has been made or a change of mind takes place the navigation has to be abandoned and started again. Can it be deleted via the 'Show Route' display?

POIs 'nearby' does not seem to give complete list of POIs (eg shopping centres) only about 13 categories given when I used it maybe because some categories are empty or not set to display on map but this DOESN'T seem to be the reason.

'POIs on Route' gives a display of a vertical bar with horizontal lines across for POIs. Not explained in user guide how is this interpreted (no distances seem to be given); which POI categories are included (eg 3 'immediate access' categories)? I wanted a category which was not shown in this display

Where the Re-routing option on TMC is set to 'on request' the warning often comes when it is over 60 kms/miles away (presumably when TMC info is first received) this is certainly far too early for me to choose whether it's necessary to divert. Is it possible to give/repeat the warning at closer distances?
[This would also make the TMC 'reroute automatically' option useful it is NOT useful in the current setup and I had to disable it I was diverted MILES back on myself to get on another route without any idea just how bad the problem was (at least we saw Lichtenstein)]

Can you confirm that when a rerouting calculation occurs (auto or 'on request'), the delay in the TMC incident is taken into account to calculate which route is chosen (original or reroute) whichever is QUICKER?

The TMC List shows distances SOMETIMES for incidents (usually when they are too large to be useful see previous point), but mostly just gives a sequential number for them, which cannot be used as a guide to decide whether to divert could the distance ALWAYS be shown? Showing a traffic incident on the map does not give the necessary information quickly when trying to drive at the same time!
"


One thing occurred that may amuse those of you mathematically inclined though I'm not bothering to mention this to them at the moment as it's probably more to do with the TTS voice producer, Nuance, and it would be almost a shame to have it corrected. When we approached a minor road near Calais designated something like D112 E1, the voice announced something like " Turn left onto the D One-One-Two raised to the power of 10" - took a few seconds to sort ourselves out on that direction!

Does anyone think it's worthwhile setting up a sticky on 8110-reported problems, or are they all being sold on ebay like hot cakes anyway?
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DaveMatthews
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PostPosted: Wed Sep 10, 2008 8:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

BigPerk wrote:
I would be grateful for any views, or advice where I have misused the facilities.


Can't help with any of the answers, sorry, but...

BigPerk wrote:

Once an Interim Destination is selected it is not possible to delete it if a mistake has been made or a change of mind takes place the navigation has to be abandoned and started again.


I haven't got an 8110 but I have downloaded the "quick view" manual for it and it says you *can* delete interims (or "route points" as Navigon calls them): you simply tap on the route point you want to remove and then click the "dustbin" icon.


BigPerk wrote:

I was diverted MILES back on myself to get on another route without any idea just how bad the problem was (at least we saw Lichtenstein)].
Can you confirm that when a rerouting calculation occurs (auto or 'on request'), the delay in the TMC incident is taken into account to calculate which route is chosen (original or reroute) whichever is QUICKER?



A-ha!! This is exactly the issue I was referring to in my previous post. Glad to hear other people are now latching on to how stupid this omission is! Given that the 8110 does not display the delay period, I would guess that it makes no use of this (very vital!) piece of information and thus just dumbly re-routes you whatever the circumstances.



BigPerk wrote:

The TMC List shows distances SOMETIMES for incidents (usually when they are too large to be useful see previous point), but mostly just gives a sequential number for them, which cannot be used as a guide to decide whether to divert could the distance ALWAYS be shown? Showing a traffic incident on the map does not give the necessary information quickly when trying to drive at the same time!


On earlier versions of Navigon, the software would place a little warning symbol on the roadmap itself, so you could visually judge how close you were to the incident.

BigPerk wrote:

Does anyone think it's worthwhile setting up a sticky on 8110-reported problems


No harm in doing so, though there doesn't seem to be a very big take-up of these units - TomTom and Garmin still massively outsell Navigon. And given the latter's track record over the last few years, most "old hands" on this forum are likely to stay away from them!

--

Cheers


Dave
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BigPerk
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PostPosted: Sun Sep 14, 2008 12:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks DaveMatthews for your helpful comments. I've made a few changes and sent off the questions - answers are awaited with the usual intense excitement Neutral
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BigPerk
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PostPosted: Thu Sep 18, 2008 3:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I've had an interim reply from Navigon to my queries, which have been "forwarded ... to our development department".

As DaveMatthews suspected (?knew Rolling Eyes ):

"When rerouting you upon TMC information the software just decides upon the incoming information not taking into account the delay of the TMC messages"

I am enquiring a little further about their intentions. Thumbs Up
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dancop
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PostPosted: Thu Sep 18, 2008 6:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I have been using my Navigon every day for the last month while touring Ireland and Northern Ireland. There are some of my impressions:

1. The maps are not so accurate as they should be. Many new (1 year old) roads are not reflected.

2. Navigon never ever tuned to any TMC station not only in Ireland but in NI also. I tried auto, hold freq and hold station options.

3. Finding a small village or even city is really a mess. If we have for example a village of Dysert O'Dea, its listed in the software as a street (SIC!) of Ennis (city located about 30 kilometers of the village). As Ireland has no post codes - finding any small village is almost impossible. You have to know approximate location of that village - find a nearest city on printed map, then type this city to Navigon and pray for that the village you are looking for is listed as a street in this city, not another one.

This really kills all fun using the Navigon and should be sorted somehow in future software releases.

4. The names of the cities and villages hve nothing to do with the offical versions of names. I had official OSI maps of Ireland and the names in the Navigon and those maps are different.

5. If you have a lot of villages with he same name (eg. Killybeg in Ireland) Navigon just lists them whihowt showing the county or other distinctions. You have to tap them and check the location on map to make the proper choice.

6. The software cannot distinct between 1.5 meters wide road (with 100 km/h speed limit Smile and 5 meters road with the same limit. So even with fast route sellected, it choses the shortest track directing you through mountains. It took us to drive 3h not planned 1h - just because I had not checked the proposed route on the printed map.

Its a nice nav equipment, but the maps, soft and TMC need some more work.
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jonandmarkuk
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PostPosted: Fri Sep 26, 2008 3:10 pm    Post subject: Re: navigon 8110 Via Michelin Reply with quote

michaelj2 wrote:
Thanks for the advice. Yes I guess we will have to wait. I will write to them again in about 2 months time.


Just spotted this on a web search.

Interesting to note the ViaMichelin logo in the top corner, this on a UK website?

http://www.b4udirect.com/index.cfm?course=/home/product/01030399/&bhcp=1#
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carlover
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PostPosted: Sat Sep 27, 2008 2:30 pm    Post subject: navigo 8110 Reply with quote

hi guys, i await your answer with baited breath because this could be the answer to all garmin narrow lane haters. Twisted Evil

Someone on the alpina forum was talking about his old navigon ,and how it never took him down unclassified roads because as well as fastest and shortest time it also had wait for it Wink OPTIMAL time

.This option along with fastest car option apparently made perfect routing.So has the 8110 still got this option?If so ive found the answer to my 6 week search, if not ill be gutted and back to square one.Good luck all
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carlover
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PostPosted: Sat Sep 27, 2008 3:17 pm    Post subject: navigon Reply with quote

this is from the alpina guy." Navigon use two methods.

First you set the vehicle, so normal, slow, fast or fastest, this will then see that you would do 90mph on a motorwayeven though it is a 70mph limit, however it also realises that you may still not avaerage more than 45mph on a single carrigeway, which is the important bit.

You then set your route choice, Fast which keeps you on motorways as much as possible, shortest which obviously takes you the shortest route or optimal.

Now optimal is the one that makes it so good imho, it will keep you on a main road all the time unless it is obvious that 3 miles across country is better than 20 miles on a motorway, and this is what most of the others miss out on. Usually there is just fast or shortest to choose from.

I know on that GPSworld forum some of the guys were hacking the Garmins route profiling to try and get it to work out things more sensibly, but I gave up and threw mine out of the Window in Scotland, kept trying to take me down 38 miles of single track rather than taking me 4 miles down a B road to get onto the dual carrigeway!!

a 40 minute journey was taking 2h30mins!!!

forum member."
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BigPerk
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PostPosted: Sun Sep 28, 2008 9:38 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The 8110 certainly has an 'Optimum' setting, but I haven't seen any description of what that is - I've set it and will see if I notice any difference (its routing seems reasonably sensible anyway, compared to the Garmin I used to have). I take it you are just considering getting one, so can't easily lay your hands on a unit?

If you are, you could post a couple of your troublesome routes here and someone could check for you. Alternatively, Halfords now stock Navigon units, so your local branch may be able to experiment for you.
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carlover
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PostPosted: Sun Sep 28, 2008 11:52 am    Post subject: navigon Reply with quote

hello BigPerk ,thanks but i travel all around the country so no specific routes ,but with garmin you soon learn about hedgerows drives me insane.People do say just ignore them and it will re route but actually you could be driving round in circles. i dont need all the bells and whistles so the 2100max could be ideal . Will go to halfords ,have a look.Until this OPTIMUM scenario turned up i was thinking of the syrious proline 2000.Cant find any info on this forum though ,shame.
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BigPerk
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PostPosted: Tue Sep 30, 2008 2:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

So - according to Navigon's press release on the 7210, "you can now also save your own special destinations and add them to the map", so the 7210 seems to have user POIs Evil or Very Mad (unless of course it's just Outlook via the Synch program).

Will the 8110 be next (if ever)? I keep nagging them about it, but no evidence of a change of heart yet. Twisted Evil Confused
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carlover
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PostPosted: Tue Sep 30, 2008 2:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

well ive bought the navigon 2100max ,didnt need the bells and whistles of the 8110. First impressions ,having to remember ive bought this for the routing possibilities,is its not as user friendly as the garmin.Much preferred the garmin map and size of all the wording (even though that was only 3.5 in) the Tmc via the power cable picks up very quickly. Can someone confirm if the camera database includes mobile authorised positions. Ill be honest regretting not waiting for the tom tom x40 that could be the one to get
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carlover
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 01, 2008 6:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

well theres a kick in the teeth. Having spoke to support they tell me the camera database does NOT include known MOBILE placings.Now im not convinced yet of the truth of that as theyre support is good or rubbish depending who you deal with.They did not know(or would not tell me) who supplies the data so i could contact direct. Searching google shows that talex has in the past supplied navigon,wonder if they still are ,my email to talex will give me the answer. If so then i reckon mobiles will be on the system,i have bought a 2100max.
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