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Speed Camera Database to Turn Professional Scandal
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davejh
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Joined: Jan 01, 2006
Posts: 32

PostPosted: Sun Jan 01, 2006 5:34 am    Post subject: Speed Camera Database to Turn Professional Scandal Reply with quote

I personally think you are absolutely out of order charging any money for a database that is compiled by your members. Will you allow those that do contribute free access to the database or will you pay those that do contribute to the database a share of the revenue? I presume the answer is no on both counts.

If you are concerned about the cost of maintaining the database with respect to bandwidth, why don’t you host the files on source forge and make the whole thing automated through php (an easy task). By using the great resources available free on source forge you would eliminate the need to charge a single penny.

http://www.pocketgpsworld.com is a great site but don’t spoil it.
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MikeB
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Location: Essex, UK

PostPosted: Sun Jan 01, 2006 3:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Dave,

Check out our discussion thread http://www.pocketgpsworld.com/modules.php?name=Forums&file=viewtopic&t=33061 where we have assimulated the feedback from the forum and presented a solution that we feel is fair to all people who contribute to the project.
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davejh
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Joined: Jan 01, 2006
Posts: 32

PostPosted: Mon Jan 02, 2006 6:18 am    Post subject: why do you delete my posts? Reply with quote

why do you delete my posts?

By deleting the posts I have made in response to your decision to charge for the safety camera database you are simply confirming your contempt for your users.

You have certainly opened a can of worms here that you are not going to be able to close. Even if you reversed your decision to charge it would be too late. You have revealed your true colors to us all. The end is near for pocketgpsworld.com as we know it.
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smstextaddict
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Joined: Nov 26, 2005
Posts: 82
Location: oxford

PostPosted: Mon Jan 02, 2006 12:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

*yawn* heres 10p call someone who cares.
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fwor
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Joined: Dec 01, 2005
Posts: 39

PostPosted: Mon Jan 02, 2006 7:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

smstextaddict wrote:
*yawn* heres 10p call someone who cares.


Well maybe ~you~ don't care, but pocketgpsworld has made a decision that drastically changes the relationship with it's members.

There's nothing unusual about that. Human nature is such that if there's an opportunity to make money then someone will probably grasp at it.

But credit (to my mind at least) to davejh for taking a stand, on principle, for a 'community' rather than a 'profit' ethic.

Good luck to you davejh - hope your alternative plans work.

And please don't take this as a post knocking pocketgpsworld - if they can make a commercial success out of their new business model then good luck to them as well (but I personally won't be buying).
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fwor
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 02, 2006 7:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hey - what's going on? My last reply was more in reply to davejh's post about making the camera data available free under GPL (General Public Licence/License) than in reply to the *yawn* post.

davejh's post just disappeared. Is there some heavy-handed censorship going on? How long before my posts start disappearing???

For the record, I have no affiliation with or knowledge of davejh other than reading his recent posts - I'm just another ordinary pocketgps 'member'.
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TazUk
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Joined: Jun 03, 2005
Posts: 130
Location: Kent, UK

PostPosted: Mon Jan 02, 2006 7:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

From reading the post MikeB has linked to it appears they have listened to the members and adopted a lot of those ideas into their new proposal. I don't think there's a fairer way they could have done it, but I'm sure others with disagree :P
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fwor
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Joined: Dec 01, 2005
Posts: 39

PostPosted: Mon Jan 02, 2006 7:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Taz - I appreciate that you've a lot more experience than me here (and I also appreciate the fact that you have helped me with advice in the past!).

But my point is that one of the pocketgps 'members' (Davejh) was discussing alternative methods, using GPL, which could run in parallel with what Pocketgpsworld is proposing. It seems his posts are being censored, not because he is saying anything fundamentally wrong, but because what he says may not fit conveniently with Pocketgpsworld's commercial objectives.

As I said in my last post, I have no connection with davejh. It just seems to me that this form of censorship is wrong.
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TazUk
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Joined: Jun 03, 2005
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 02, 2006 8:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Obviously I'm against censorship and if posts have been deleted then there's no way of going back and seeing what their contents where Confused

I'm not sure whether Sourceforge could be used in that way but the bandwidth issue is only part of the problem. The bigger issue I think is the time required to collate and check the information given. Up until now this has been done by the the admins in their spare time 8O The only logical solution would be to employ someone to do this, which of course would require paying them to. The fly in the ointment is the fact that the members here are the ones contributing the information that goes into this database. The new proposal seems to deal with this issue as fairly as possible.

I haven't been a member here long, but during my short stay I've found the site very helpful. I hope this will continue into the future and we will all have a peaceful 2006 :D
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davejh
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Joined: Jan 01, 2006
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 02, 2006 8:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

fwor wrote:
As I said in my last post, I have no connection with davejh. It just seems to me that this form of censorship is wrong.


Yes it certainly seems that censorship is the order of the day.

If I am not allowed to put my point of view across in a forum then whets the point of having a forum. I was simply hoping to discuss my plans of starting a new GPL based database to gauge how much interest there would be. But if the forum moderator’s don’t want me to discuss this there is not a whole lot I can do about that. But it does make me all the more determined to press ahead with my plans.
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neil01
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Joined: May 06, 2005
Posts: 902
Location: Leeds

PostPosted: Mon Jan 02, 2006 8:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

davejh wrote:
fwor wrote:
As I said in my last post, I have no connection with davejh. It just seems to me that this form of censorship is wrong.


Yes it certainly seems that censorship is the order of the day.

If I am not allowed to put my point of view across in a forum then whets the point of having a forum. I was simply hoping to discuss my plans of starting a new GPL based database to gauge how much interest there would be. But if the forum moderator’s don’t want me to discuss this there is not a whole lot I can do about that. But it does make me all the more determined to press ahead with my plans.


While not going into the rights and wrongs of the current situation, or your posts in particular. Some of the posts which have been deleted have probably contraveined some forum rules. And others have been no more than competition advertising!

Taking another example, anyone has the right to set up a new supermarket, but do they have the right to advertise it in Tesco - I don't think so. If Tesco tore down the advertising on their premises, I hardly think they would be accused of censorship.

While I feel that some of the post have been justifiably deleted, I have seen other posts (nothing to do with this issue) not aimed at team members or the running of the site which have been allowed to remain. Now I am not suggesting that the other posts should be censored now, but I would sincerely hope that we see even handedness from now on.
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fwor
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Joined: Dec 01, 2005
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 02, 2006 9:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I hope you'll find that the moderators will realise that suppressing people who express different ideas than they have doesn't look good on a supposedly 'open' forum.

I suspect that there is some validity to the view that the 'open source' community will not be an ideal home for something which will require a lot of seemingly unglamorous and repetitive administrative work (checking input data and updating the database). But I don't see why you should be prevented from trying to see if it can be made to work.

Hopefully the moderators will allow you to continue to discuss the issues and propose alternatives - which can work in parallel with what they have already decided - without resorting to further censorship.
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Ako
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Joined: Oct 28, 2004
Posts: 128
Location: Cheshire

PostPosted: Mon Jan 02, 2006 10:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Neil01 wrote:
Quote:
While I feel that some of the post have been justifiably deleted, I have seen other posts (nothing to do with this issue) not aimed at team members or the running of the site which have been allowed to remain. Now I am not suggesting that the other posts should be censored now, but I would sincerely hope that we see even handedness from now on.


Not sure what category (censorship or evebhandedness) to put belated editing of replies to show things in a better light as Darren did to my post in the speed camera database thread.

Dave
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D-N
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Posts: 11

PostPosted: Mon Jan 02, 2006 10:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I just had a look and today there are 25358 registered users of the forum. plus possibly twice as many unregistered users of the database

Who could turn down the chance to earn £300,000 to £400,000 a year profit from the database??? Not me. I dont blame you for charging if you can get away with it.

fair play to any one who can set it up. Shame the people who provided the data can't be rewarded though

Friends reunited (just as simple an idea) has made tens of millions
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Ako
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Location: Cheshire

PostPosted: Mon Jan 02, 2006 11:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

D-N wrote:
Quote:
Who could turn down the chance to earn £300,000 to £400,000 a year profit from the database??? Not me. I dont blame you for charging if you can get away with it.


So if you can get away with it it's ok eh. Lots of businesses have failed with that kind of work ethic.

Dave
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