Joined: Jan 14, 2005 Posts: 19636 Location: Blackpool , Lancs
Posted: Thu Jul 01, 2010 7:51 pm Post subject:
They need to take a long hard look at the quality of the POI files they supply with a device, its nothing short of pathetic in comparison to the location data you can get for free off this site as well as many others.
As for Safety Cameras (which is what TomTom call them) nothing short of a joke, even on the high end devices with the so called "Premium Camera Database" containing data supplied from Road Angel (A credible outfit) its just as bad, we have even seen requests for help from the boss of Road Angel on this and other forums who cannot understand why the data is so poor when combined directly on the TomTom outside of the originators control.
I have no knowledge as to what TomTom manage to do with quality data but such collaborative ventures can (and have) reflected badly on the original supplier of the quality data.
Whether I would trust any Speed Camera database supplied via TomTom Home (irrespective of source) when there are other supplies of car based navigation products that still offer true un-intrusive ways of loading POI files to a device is a no brainer of a decision - I wouldn't bother wasting space on the windscreen with hardware that doesn't let me as a device owner decide what goes on my device - Mike
Joined: Aug 31, 2005 Posts: 11984 Location: Bradford, West Yorkshire
Posted: Thu Jul 01, 2010 11:33 pm Post subject:
I blame Apple.
I'm going to take a wild stab at what you are referring to here... presumably you mean because of the success of the TomTom app for iPhone / iPod Touch you feel that TomTom like the Apple 'lock down' and want some of their own?
Thing is, Sygic and CoPilot have also been very succesful on Apple devices yet their other products (for WinMob and Android) DO allow custom POIs - Sygic even having full OGG support a-la TomTom (well, in their past-life). Both of these, on a jailbroken device, will also accept 3rd party speed cameras and POIs - Sygic with custom OGG warnings.
Navigon, the first navigation app available on the iPhone (and my personal favourite) have gone the opposite direction. While you cannot add custom POIs on the iPhone, Android or WinMob versions their latest PND's, I read this week, have started adding support for CSV files for custom POIs. Their older devices also allow software like POIWarner to run on them.
So, these 3 companies manage to have success in the AppStore without letting it affect their other devices - why then can't TomTom?
Perhaps I've misunderstood why exactly you blame Apple - if so then please do expand!
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Joined: Nov 25, 2004 Posts: 328 Location: DFW, Texas, USA
Posted: Thu Jul 01, 2010 11:40 pm Post subject:
I blame Apple.
I'm going to take a wild stab at what you are referring to here... presumably you mean because of the success of the TomTom app for iPhone / iPod Touch you feel that TomTom like the Apple 'lock down' and want some of their own?...
Perhaps I've misunderstood why exactly you blame Apple - if so then please do expand!
Pretty much, mostly the latter part. What I meant was I blame Apple for making it acceptable to the end luser to be happy with a closed, proprietary system that can only be customized in certain, limited and Apple-approved ways. As much as Microsoft is currently racing their Windows Mobile ship towards the bottom (see KIN), at least those devices could be customized to the user's content. Apple changed that game and now everybody is me-too!-wanna!-ing _________________ Eclipse AVN2210P
Joined: Jun 19, 2006 Posts: 203 Location: Sahrf Lunnon ;)
Posted: Fri Jul 02, 2010 3:41 am Post subject:
Off topic somewhat...
Kar98's got something of a point there; it's not for nothing that a fair few folks I know say that the "i" in "iPhone" stands for "idiot". The phone is aimed (pun not intended on Kar98's nick!) at people who frankly can't be bothered in reading manuals - it's intended to be simple to use, trendy, and thus "cool". The perception in many peoples eyes of Windows Mobile devices is that they're clunky, slow, unwieldy things that always go wrong, and that are aimed at the business community.
While these perceptions may have accurate enough roots, they're very much an oversimplification of the current situation. Windows Mobile devices are, in WM6.1 and 6.5, quite versatile, and very impressive in capabilities - easily on a par and, in many cases exceeding, the capabilities of the iPhone series.
Also, there's no "Kill Switch" system in WM devices - if you install something, you get to keep it. In those Jobsian devices - and, in fact, also in Android Devices as well, come to think of it - there's a "Remote Application Removal Feature" that enables both Apple and Google to remotely delete software packages they consider to be, for whatever reason, undesirable on devices running their operating systems.
Then, we come to RIM, or BlackBerry, devices. Yup, not a lot of stuff out there, it seems... not that I've really looked at the situation much - I know there are software packages out there for them, I just haven't a clue of the extent or usability of them.
In penultimate place, there's Nokia, and we know a fair bit about them, of course, what with Ovi maps, and such like. Again, I don't know the extent of the software that's available to be installed on their phones, but I have to assume it's not as wide a range as for WM and Apple devices.
Finally, there' the little used, but much more open, Linux devices. There aren't many of them about: Android is based on Linux, but it's not a true Linux OS: It's a customised version. The range is looking like it'll increase, though, and as Linux is an open operating system, my gut feeling is that we'll start to see more Linux devices knocking around over the coming years, especially as Ubuntu is becoming more widely used by home users wanting to save money.
The only problem there is the general image that the average Linux user has had in the recent past - long haired hippy types, code diving here, and tweaking there, all while sipping some horrid concoction of rose-leaf and God-knows-what herbal infusion... kinda makes the mind recoil in horror, but there y'go ;)
So. In two of the six operating systems out there, you could lose a software package without warning. In another, it's got a poor rep for usability by the non-business crowd (and it's devices tend to be rather expensive too); in two others, they're apparently limited as to available packages, and the last one's so little known about that hardly anyone has one.
All in all, there's not a whole hell of a lot to choose between, then.
So, I'll stick with what I know, which is Windows Mobile, for the moment... however, while I'm not some hippy type, I do like the idea of saving my hard-earned cash, so I'm going to be watching the Linux mobile device situation VERY closely over the next couple of years, for when it comes time to replace my current HTC Touch Pro 2 WM device. _________________ Roger, G1LIW
GPS unit HTC Sensation Android Smartphone | Satnav Package NavFree | User of CamerAlert for Android | Blog http://rogersblant.blogspot.com/
Joined: 11/07/2002 14:36:40 Posts: 23700 Location: Hampshire, UK
Posted: Fri Jul 02, 2010 7:18 am Post subject:
Let's not make this an anti-Apple thread please. This has nothing to do with them and, as a techy and Apple user I strongly disagree with the sentiment that Apple is all about being trendy and nothing else.
I like them because they work and don't need tweaking, fiddling, editing of the registry etc just to do the job I need. I've had WM for many years, I have an Android device and a BB and yet I come back to iPhone every time simply because, for me at least, they are by far the best.
So let's stick to the issue at hand, the why's and wherefore's are known only to TT at the end of the day. _________________ Darren Griffin - Editor I ran the 2013 London Marathon in support of the National Autistic Society see here.
It's staggering to think that TT is so arrogant that they think they can command the loyalty akin to that demonstrated by Apple customers and thus can afford to disable features that make their devices more attractive to the buying public.
I recently tried one of the new Live units - it's OK, but not such a sea-change from my current 520. What was worse, it was so adament that the M4 was closed at one point, due to a Live update I assume, it just refused to route via the M4! Had it been my unit, I would have "played" with the settings more to "turn off" this helpful nannying The eco-routing seemed to come up with the complete counter-intuitive ways of getting from A-B.
When the time comes, I will certainly be looking at alternative manufacturers who have a more supportive attitude to the needs and wants of their customers.
Posted: Fri Jul 02, 2010 8:02 am Post subject: 3rd Party POI Audible alerts
Could this be pressure from governments to prevent loss of income. In our area they set up 20mph zone around the schools near us but this speed limit applies 24/7 although introduced for child safety. So why do the police need to use a portable speed camera at 15.00hrs on a Sunday!!!! No children are going to school so no road safety issues this must only be for conviction ratings and fines income!!!
This is so much the way everything goes - first ebay introduced this type of thing, then Apple has been enormously successful in creaming money from everything downloaded from the iTunes store (including TomTom!) so if TomTom does the same then they are only following the monopolistic practises that people like Apple have done so successfully.
Perhaps TomTom is wrong and its customers are not the same as the Apple fanbois but its going to take a noticable drop of sales before they change this model and as previously discussed, most people only download what is thrust in their faces and don't look for better and cheaper alternatives.
I actually applaud TomTom as this just means I can now rely on Google Maps (free) and the £0.59 in the iTunes store for the PGPSW Cameras database so I can stop thinking about carrying another device around and for the added functionality - err - no thank you for that cost
They are no longer the TomTom of even a couple years ago. A shame.
I have used tomtom on my PDA or Phone for coming up 10 years (all the way back to the earliest palm pilots that it ran on). At the moment I am waiting until Windows Mobile 7 comes out and will get a new phone then. With this news, I won't buy another version of TomTom even if they do make a WM7 version.
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